Last call for Fiero roll bars and roll cages

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Doug Chase
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Last call for Fiero roll bars and roll cages

Post by Doug Chase »

Hi Everybody,

I thought I'd give you all a heads up that sometime in the near future (next couple months) I will cease production of Fiero roll bars and cages for mail order. I will still happily do them for any Fiero that can make it to my shop in Duvall, Washington.

Here's why:

1) The car I have been using as a jig is finally going to begin its transformation into a rally car. Once there's a cage welded into it I obviously won't be able to use it as a jig any longer.

2) For the small number of Fiero bars and cages that I sell and the small amount of money I make on each one, it's not worth my time / money / space to build a jig or get another car to use as a jig.

If you've been thinking about getting a roll bar or roll cage for your Fiero, contact me now via email. doug (at) chaserace (dot) com. http://www.chaserace.com/cage/fierocage.html

Thanks!
Doug Chase
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eHoward
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Post by eHoward »

I would take measurements of existing parts on plywood and use that as a guide to make future bars.


I wasn't planning on buying a roll cage until I actually had the crazy engine in mine.

How silly would it be to use an IT style frame without the rear strut ties?

Guess I should read a Solo 1 rulebook.
Doug Chase
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Post by Doug Chase »

eHoward wrote:I would take measurements of existing parts on plywood and use that as a guide to make future bars.
Actually, duplicating the bars is even easier than that. Once I build one I just have to record the distances and angles of bends. Then I could build another one from a notebook.

The difficult part is making the mounting plates and getting the bar attached to the plates in exactly the right spot at exactly the right angle. If you check out this picture http://www.chaserace.com/cage/images/sh ... 40x480.jpg you can see that the mounting plate is curved so the cut at the end of the bar has to be curved to match. Note also that the bar hits the plate at an angle. So for various reasons that I'm sure you can figure out, this makes the tubing / plate interface time consuming to make and difficult to duplicate without a jig.

It would be much easier without having the interior to work around.
eHoward wrote:How silly would it be to use an IT style frame without the rear strut ties?

Guess I should read a Solo 1 rulebook.
Haven't you heard? It's no longer Solo 1, it's Solo Trials now!

My brief skim over the rules a week ago indicated that if the car is prepared to Stock or Street Prepared rules then it doesn't need a roll bar. If it's prepared beyond that (and even something like changing the cam counts) then it needs a roll bar and has to have rear braces. I need to dig up the book for another project so I'll let you know what I find out.
Doug Chase
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stimpy
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Post by stimpy »

Doug, I'm concerned about safety, but not about competing in SCCA events or rollover accidents, and I can't afford to lose any legroom to seat travel. However, with all the lifted pickups and SUV's around here, a halo bar and a NASCAR bar would be something I'd be interested in. Is there any way to incorporate that? I'd be willing to cut the dash.
I just want to preserve my noggin, and I think driving the streets with a helmet on might draw too much attention from the cops, plus it might not help when a Silverado decides to park inside my glovebox.
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Post by The Dark Side of Will »

Air horn.


Doug, remember the mods to the roll cage that we discussed?
I guess if you're not going to make them anymore, then I need to order that cage from you.
Email will be sent momentarily.
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Post by Chase Race »

Howard, I looked up the Solo I rules. Somebody asked on Pennock's as well and here's what I posted there. Sorry for the cut and paste.

The bar required for SCCA Solo I (recently renamed to "Club Trials" for who knows what reason) is a main hoop with a diagonal brace and braces to the strut towers. Basically the back half of this cage, but I can make it narrower to fit with the interior installed:

Image

The harness bar isn't required, but you want one. This is the basic design that most sanctioning bodies require, and unfortunately it doesn't fit into an unmolested interior because of the center console and the back window. Depending on your particular track inspectors they may or may not allow you to fudge that and go with the double-diagonal and (removable) Petty bar like I built for Hugh, because the Improved Touring rules do have an allowance for a Petty bar instead of the strut tower bars.

The Solo I rules do not, however, so check with somebody first and don't be surprised if they say no. If they say yes, ask for it in writing. If you want to contact somebody at SCCA's national office I can point you in that direction.

The rulebook also outlines the loads that a roll bar must bear, so it would be possible to have the bar tested to see if it met their standards. I see no reason it shouldn't but I haven't done it. Time and money - it basically involves building and destroying a bar and a car with an expensive piece of machinery and paying an engineer to witness it.

The sad fact of the matter is that there just isn't enough extra room in the Fiero to fit in a good bar / cage and not notice it. Stimpy, this bites you, too. Door bars are also very difficult to do. If you have the stock seats, roll down the window and shut the door and look at where the seat touches the B-pillar. This is where the door bar needs to go but the interior and seat are in the way. If you change seats then the armrest is still in the way.

The bottom line is that I think the door bars on a street car could make the car more dangerous instead of less because there are more hard things for body parts to hit and they're very close to your body.

Main hoops can also dangerous without helmets if it's possible for it to come in contact with your head. Will had some good ideas for squeezing in a main hoop in this thread: http://www.fiero.com/forum/Archives/Arc ... 52702.html It probably wouldn't meet any sanctioning bodies rules, but if you're more concerned with actual safety it should work well.
Doug Chase
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Post by The Dark Side of Will »

Chase Race wrote:If you change seats then the armrest is still in the way.
I think that removable door bars would work fairly well because the armrest comes out in about 1 minute with three screws... and you shouldn't be using the armrest in competition anyway :thumbleft:
Get to the race venue, remove armrests, install door bars.

I get what you're saying about having hard steel close to the body, though. Any thing close enough to come in contact with part of the driver needs to be heavily padded.
http://www.fiero.com/forum/Archives/Arc ... 52702.html It probably wouldn't meet any sanctioning bodies rules, but if you're more concerned with actual safety it should work well.
Funny the way that works...

Your harness bar and your normal diagonal bars make a small triangle above the center console. If I install a bar like that, I'm liable to get a ticket for rear visibility obstruction, since I live in VA. Would it be possible to turn that into a trapezoid instead of a triangle? IE, instead of having those two sections angle inward, angle them outward at the same angle?

How much of an impact do you think that would have on bar strength and rearward visibility?
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Post by Series8217 »

Will, are you sure the rear visbility obstruction laws apply if you have both side mirrors? I thought we had the most strict car laws in California and as far as I know we can paint out our rear windows solid as long as we have side mirrors..

EDIT: Found your vehicle code online, it matches ours:
Section 46.2-1052:
"...whenever a motor vehicle is equipped with a mirror on each side of such vehicle, so located as to reflect to the driver of such vehicle a view of the highway for at least 200 feet to the rear of such vehicle, any or all of the following shall be lawful:
[...]
3. To drive a motor vehicle when the driver's clear view of the highway through the rear window or windows is otherwise obstructed."

:thumbleft:
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Post by The Dark Side of Will »

Doesn't stop cops from hassling people about it.
I make it down to VA Beach every now and then and I've heard of people with box stock down to the paper air filter EVO's getting tickets for aftermarket exhaust (with the STOCK exhaust) and rear visibility obstruction from the STOCK spoiler. Of course VB has some phucked up city statutes, but the fact that it's legal seldom stops cops from giving you shit about it.
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Post by Series8217 »

Just keep a copy of the relevant vehicle code sections in your glove box to show to the officer. You've got to control your rights, man!
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Post by The Dark Side of Will »

Uhh... Spam?

(NM... aparently deleted)
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