3.4L DOHC Short Runner Intake: Video

Real tech discussion on design, fabrication, testing, development of custom or adapted parts for Pontiac Fieros. Not questions about the power a CAI will give.

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Blue Shift
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3.4L DOHC Short Runner Intake: Video

Post by Blue Shift »

Dunno if I mentioned this before, but I just got done building a 3.4L DOHC short runner intake using some mathematical guidelines to determine runner length, plenum volume, and throttle body to plenum ram tube length and diameter (for velocity). I'm certainly not the first to cut the plenum off of the stock plenum/runner assembly, saw the runners down short, and weld on a tube type plenum, but I haven't seen anybody try to optimize the functional parts of the intake for a specific result. I decided I wanted the runners to come in at ~6000 RPM to prop up to top end of the powerband where big power is made. I used 2 different methods to determine my runner length:

1.) David Vizards Formula The general rule is that you should begin with a runner length of 17.8 cm for a 10,000 rpm peak torque location, from the intake opening to the plenum chamber. You add 4.3 cm to the runner length for every 1000 rpm that you want the peak torque to occur before the 10,000 rpm.
For 6000 RPM, Length = 35cm

2.) Another Formula to Calculate Runner Length for a Specific Peak Torque RPM: from Steve Magnante at Hot Rod magazine N x L = 84,000 where N represents the desired engine rpm for peak torque and L is the length in inches from the opening of the runner tube to the valve head.
For 6000 RPM, L = 14.0" or 35.56 centimeters to the valve head

I also did a lot of reading about plenum volume and plenum to throttle body ram pipe length and diameter from the book "How to Tune and Modify Engine Management Systems" by Jeff Hartman. Look it up on Google Books, pages 119 to 121 are all you need. Anyways, I ended up with a plenum roughtly 60% of the displacement of the engine, and a 12" throttle body ram pipe. Interestingly, the stock GM 96-7 throttle body arm diameter was dead on at 2.75" ID, which I repeated when I made mine from polished aluminum pipe.

Anyways, A picture right after I rolled the car out of the bay (still needs polishing/painting, and final routing of hoses and wiring to make it pretty):
Image

[Edit]: Plenum is 60%, not 40%
Last edited by Blue Shift on Wed Oct 21, 2009 1:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Shaun41178(2)
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Re: 3.4L DOHC Short Runner Intake: Video

Post by Shaun41178(2) »

sounds amazing. you can really hear the pitch change at 6k. I watched the vid several times before reading your post, thinking I was hearing something else then intake harmonics.

Can you feel a change in power at 6k rpm?
FieroPhrek working on that ls4 swap for 18 years and counting now. 18 years!!!!! LOL

530 whp is greater than 312
Blue Shift
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Re: 3.4L DOHC Short Runner Intake: Video

Post by Blue Shift »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WkCUodmhn7E I didn't get to post the video before the forum crashed, so here it is.

Shaun - I think the cold air rice pipe from the TB to the filter is making the throaty growl from 3K up that gets louder. It could possibly be the TB ram pipe or the plenum adding to induction boom too. Stevens setup also produces a very similar sound in about the same place as well. The abrupt change in tone and intensity at 6K is almost certainly the tuned runners kicking in, possibly with some help from the TB ram pipe which probably comes in just after 6K since the powerband feels very strong all the way to 7. So much so that the first thing I did was bang right into the limiter.

As for extra power at 6K, I swear the tach needle accelerates noticeably right at 6K when the sound changes, and the car pulls hard all the way to fuel cut. Steven mentioned the same thing on a test run, so I guess it's not my imagination. This intake HAS to have made a double digit power increase. When I get some money, I want to get it on a dyno to see what that torque curve looks like.
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Shaun41178(2)
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Re: 3.4L DOHC Short Runner Intake: Video

Post by Shaun41178(2) »

You already have a local dyno in mind where you would take it?
FieroPhrek working on that ls4 swap for 18 years and counting now. 18 years!!!!! LOL

530 whp is greater than 312
Blue Shift
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Re: 3.4L DOHC Short Runner Intake: Video

Post by Blue Shift »

Shaun41178(2) wrote:You already have a local dyno in mind where you would take it?
Nothing personally known to me, but there are some in the area, plus people I know surely know. It's Los Angeles. If one can't be found here, then they don't exist. :good:

Now I just gotta not be broke...
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Series8217
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Re: 3.4L DOHC Short Runner Intake: Video

Post by Series8217 »

Take it to Church, then we can directly compare ours.
Blue Shift
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Re: 3.4L DOHC Short Runner Intake: Video

Post by Blue Shift »

Assuming you're not talking about the religious institution, that's what I had in mind. :good:
FieroWanaBe1
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Re: 3.4L DOHC Short Runner Intake: Video

Post by FieroWanaBe1 »

Build yourself some 24-26" headers to compliment that intake, and you should see the same resonance gains on the exhaust side.
car.
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Aaron
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Re: 3.4L DOHC Short Runner Intake: Video

Post by Aaron »

Build a turbo kit, fuck the harmonics, and hold on!

Really though, sounds amazing. And I wouldn't doubt 220whp at all!
88GT 3.4 DOHC Turbo
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Series8217
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Re: 3.4L DOHC Short Runner Intake: Video

Post by Series8217 »

Aaron wrote:Build a turbo kit, fuck the harmonics, and hold on!

Really though, sounds amazing. And I wouldn't doubt 220whp at all!
Mine did 220 whp... I'm sure his does more.
Atilla the Fun
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Re: 3.4L DOHC Short Runner Intake: Video

Post by Atilla the Fun »

That'd be really neat if you get a CVT to keep the rpm between 6000 and 7??0 rpm, but barring that, mostly due to how much power CVTs eat, The next step is some Pauter rods, and twist that thing to 8500.
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Aaron
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Re: 3.4L DOHC Short Runner Intake: Video

Post by Aaron »

That sounded spectacular. I can't imagine how mine would have sounded if I had actually done my ITBs. I love the scream of these motors, one of my favorite things about them.
Blue Shift
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Re: 3.4L DOHC Short Runner Intake: Video

Post by Blue Shift »

The sound is just incredible... Even if it wasn't worth 5 HP, it makes the car so much more fun to drive now. That said, the difference up top is night and day. Where the stock setup used to discourage venturing north of 6000 RPM, the new system pulls happily to redline - way more torque near redline. How much that's worth, only the dyno will be able to tell.

I always thought it would be awesome to to build a bulletproof DOHC with a modded 3500 steel crank, modded SBC 4340 rods, forged pistons, lightweight lifters, and comp beehive type springs up top. Maybe lose some rotating mass by gun drilling cams and the intermediate shaft (admittedly at the wrong distance from the axis of rotation to do much though). Then spin the thing to 8000 or 8500 with a well built, tuned intake, and tuned headers. With a significant increase in redline and the ability to keep it fed, 300 HP should be quite possible.

Probably cheaper to turbo a more or less stock engine to make the same kind of power, but it's already been done.
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Series8217
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Re: 3.4L DOHC Short Runner Intake: Video

Post by Series8217 »

Blue Shift wrote:Assuming you're not talking about the religious institution, that's what I had in mind. :good:
http://home.earthlink.net/~spchurch/
Honest Don
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Re: 3.4L DOHC Short Runner Intake: Video

Post by Honest Don »

cool stuff for sure! :good:



did you happen to do the math on where a stock intake sits? I'm kinda curious of what the GM engineers had in mind
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