Darkhorizon + a budget more than a hamburger =

[Jinxmutt]

Great run!! Cut a few tenths off that 60 and you'll be closing in on the 9s!

[darkhorizon]

Congrats on the time!
Get a cage so you can continue to dial it in.

There is a "no tech" race every month so I shouldnt have any problems keeping it without a cage. I figure as long as I leave the doors in tact, I would probably be better off with no cage over no door bars/cage.

[Shaun41178(2)]

Very nice. Congrats on the times. Def a fast fiero there. You said you were under 14 psi the whole time?

[darkhorizon]

I have no clue what my boost was, it was probably around 20psi, my 60# injectors were sitting around 70%. The rest of the setup is pretty efficient.

The trap speed for that run was probably alot lower than it should have been because I made a small error that subtracted 14 degrees of timing for the last 2 seconds of the run.

[alltrbo]

There is a "no tech" race every month so I shouldnt have any problems keeping it without a cage. I figure as long as I leave the doors in tact, I would probably be better off with no cage over no door bars/cage.

Have you ever seen a car (any car), flip at 135mph? The NHRA has cage certifications for a reason.

Thanks for following through with clear videos.

[Matt Hawkins]

Nice run. Glad to see the good results.

[The Dark Side of Will]

Congrats on the time!
Get a cage so you can continue to dial it in.

There is a "no tech" race every month so I shouldnt have any problems keeping it without a cage. I figure as long as I leave the doors in tact, I would probably be better off with no cage over no door bars/cage.

Lol... I've flipped a Fiero at 60 mph and narrowly escaped decapitation. It was a sunroof car. The top of the roofline came to the base of my skull afterward.

[darkhorizon]

Ill try my hardest to block out peppy and not do a barrel roll.

[alltrbo]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FSZDMZYroCY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IeXpziXP-Bg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ROGhcRdznw

Your car looked a bit twitchy as you were headed down that track. You have a lot of lift in that lightweight front end as evidenced by the headlight doors flipping even with your hood popped (ghetto "fix" FTL), of course it doesn't take a genius to figure out that a nose of that shape on a car with massive
pro-squat that weighs nothing in the front end, and accelerates that hard, will have a light, touchy, barely controlled steering (whether it feels like it or not). Oh, and don't forget the horrible caster that breeds high speed instability, and the short wheelbase does nothing to help either, nor do those mushy wrinkle walls with only a few PSI in them.

Your ~25 year old car's suspension and steering wasn't of the greatest quality... 25 years ago... and the space frame is not as strong as you seem to think.

"But my super-special Fiero is super planted and super reliable. I fixed all of the stability problems that GM built into this car (25 years ago... before anything was even worn out). The cars in the videos were all soooo much faster and taller than my Fiero, my Fiero is very very stable, and I'm a better driver than those losers. I was purposely moving the steering wheel back and forth while driving in a straight line. Even when I decide that I can launch even harder and lift the wheels to prove to FieroX that I'm more of an internet badass than he is, I'll never, ever flip or crash my super special Fiero."

Okay then, so what happens when the 9-second car slightly ahead of you in the other lane loses it (because he's not as super-special as you) and darts straight into the fender of your car at 100mph?

Think about it.

[darkhorizon]

While I do completely agree with the post above there, I am just not sure if a cage will save me from a wall related crash, etc...

I would much rather investigate making things as safe as possible, more so than the safety equip which will come with time (I want to build a new fiero, as it would be weird not driving one to work.. DDing a cage car is sorta a bitch).

The wheel moves around like that when I am just cruising at 60mph... as John said earlier, the whole "slicks in the rear, radials up front" thing works horribly.

[Sinister Fiero]

Could you post up some pics of your engine compartment? I was told you completely cut out your trunk wall behind the engine and there is no longer any support between the rear strut towers in your car. Is this true? If so, I imagine with no lateral support between the strut towers, this could be contributing to your stability issues.

[darkhorizon]

I just cut the "strut tower bar" part out that holds the trunk light.

I didnt have any "stability" problems with street tires on it, going any speed. The impossibly thin sidewall of these tires are just going to make a sway unless the alignment is dead nuts, which it isnt (belletire screwed me around). The rear lower control link was impossible to remove from my cradle, so I didnt replace the bushings in them.. which is most likely why I have issues in general.

When the slicks are on and I am going forward it feels really stable inside, with little to no sway. I probably appeared to be overdriving it due to nerves more so than because it was all over.

[Blue Shift]

If I had to cut any part of the trunk out (I went to great lengths on my DOHC to keep the trunk intact), the reinforcement bar at the top would be the last thing I'd cut... Sounds like you lose a lot of rigidity between strut towers for like, 1" more clearance - bad payoff IMHO.

[darkhorizon]

Everything fit fine, I just didnt see much use for it. I still dont.

I am still fairly convinced it is no different than any FWD car without that center support. I wont autocross the thing, but with non radial tires on it I dont see how I could ever put enough sideload on those to deflect anything.

[The Dark Side of Will]

Body/chassis stiffness is absolutely critical to everything a racecar has to do.

What loads the strut towers? The rear springs. When the rear springs compress, you're increasing the load on the strut towers. When do the rear springs compress in a drag car? During the hole shot, when you're putting the most torque through the driveline and asking the most of your suspension.

Tie a static (non-stretchy) string between the strut towers just taught enough to be straight across. Have a passenger turn around and watch the string while you launch. Let us know if it goes slack.

FWD cars suck without extra bracing. A FWD engine bay is a two-sided box, which is terrible for stiffness. You've made your Fiero engine bay a one-sided box.

[Sinister Fiero]

Body/chassis stiffness is absolutely critical to everything a racecar has to do.

What loads the strut towers? The rear springs. When the rear springs compress, you're increasing the load on the strut towers. When do the rear springs compress in a drag car? During the hole shot, when you're putting the most torque through the driveline and asking the most of your suspension.

Tie a static (non-stretchy) string between the strut towers just taught enough to be straight across. Have a passenger turn around and watch the string while you launch. Let us know if it goes slack.

FWD cars suck without extra bracing. A FWD engine bay is a two-sided box, which is terrible for stiffness. You've made your Fiero engine bay a one-sided box.

x2

Furthermore, think of this: Standing at the back of your car, look at the angles of the rear struts/springs. They are not straight up and down. They have an inward tilt at the top. As the rear suspension loads up (more weight being put on it), there is more force that the springs/struts will try to push on the tops of the strut towers inwards toward the engine bay on both sides. This can be demonstrated by Will's string test, and I will be shocked if your string stays taut no matter the driving situation.

When you cut away that support brace you think does "little to nothing", you've effectively left your strut towers with NO lateral support whatsoever. The only lateral support you have left is at the bottom where the cradle bolts to the chassis and the very rear trunk wall - both are too far away from the tops of the strut towers to be effective.

Like Will said, you've effectively turned your engine bay into a one sided box. I wouldn't feel safe driving that car at 30mph let alone 130. And I certainly wouldn't want to be in it should ANY kind of accident occur, on the track or off.

[darkhorizon]

I imagine it sucks in some, and 88's have alot more inward rake than the pregens as well.

I will be putting a bar in there... But I honestly think a swaybar will give more stability than adding a brace up here would.

You also forgot about the small, but still functional top frame-rails.

[The Dark Side of Will]

Everything we said takes those into account.

[alltrbo]

Well that just goes to show you that it doesn't take an intelligent person to build a 10-second car.

[darkhorizon]

For the record, I did not notice any handling issues with this upper support missing... It went down the track just as smooth and straight as it always has with bias ply tires. When I still had the radials on, it handled just as stiff and accurately as it always has.