Painting a Fiero, calling EMC

[CincinnatiFiero]

I am going to paint my 87, its looked like shit and I haven't driven it because it looks bad. So its time to give painting a whirl, my friend and I have been prepping the car down with a DA and 80 grit, some of the panels had been repainted more times than others, but we've got it nice and uniform now and down pretty far.

So, from here, what type of primer do you guys recommend on the fieros?

Also, it is my understanding we need to add a flex agent to the paint for the urethane panels. But the doors, the fenders, the 1/4 panels, and the bumpers are all urethane, only the rear clip and hoods are harder. Can I paint the harder panels with the flex agent in the paint? Someone told me if you paint the hard panels with flex agent in them you will get a lot of orange peel.

My intention was to do a panel on paint job so it would be easier to do the whole car with one batch of paint.

Does the flex agent need to be in the primer? I would think so, just wanted to clarify.

And finally, is been so long since I've worked on a fiero, how do you get the door black trim and the short fender trim off?


My friend who is helping me works at Napa, we just ordered a $200 retail gun at cost, and we can get all the materials there as well.

The car is medium red metallic and I intend to do base-clear.

[CincinnatiFiero]

Just talked to someone who said urethane paint doesn't need a flex agent.

[Shaun41178(2)]

I think emc said that his paint guy said he didn't need flex, and he didn't use it, and is now regretting it because its cracking. I think I remember something like that with a 3000 gt he painted. Maybe I am wrong though. Too lazy to go back and read his thread right now.

[Emc209i]

Better late than never....

Paul, I don't have the time to sit down to type up the response I want to, so I'm going to pass for tonight. I've got a lot of tips and information that will help you. I'll plan to come back tomorrow. I would call, but I think explaining here will help everyone.

I can't say that Shaun is completely incorrect, because I did skip using a flex agent on advice from a local. But the paint on the stealth is not cracking, and I'm truly happy that I took the advice seriously. Flex agent is completely unnecessary with urethane on the Fiero - I'll explain in depth later. There are lots of new technologies, but you should be focusing on urethane paints, because of your experience. You will be wasting a lot of material your first spray, so choosing a cheap and easy to work with material is what you need. I know you're incredibly sharp, so am I. I voraciously read everything I could find for a three month period, and I can tell you, until you pull the trigger on your new gun, you're living in a different world. Not to sound cliche, but experience will literally cement your knowledge and understanding. You can read for years, but until you get some gun time, you will never know what works for you. It's hard to tie all the ends when you don't have the experience, very easy when you do.

Because of this, I can only recommend Nason paint, simply because of its value per dollar. I don't know of another brand that delivers professional results at such a low price point. I have been through three gallons of Nason clear on the little Fiero. Keep in mind the plebeian simpletons at piffle are telling people they only need half a gallon to do a car. I've sanding two gallons of clear from panels. I can spray correctly now, know what I'm doing, and use more expensive materials now. But I'm very happy that I started out with humble tools and materials, simply because I lacked the talent to use them at first. Nason is also very easy to work with, a quality a new painter appreciates very much.

I've got to go...
Knowing you, I doubt you're pressed for time. Tomorrow, I'll open Pandora's box.

[CincinnatiFiero]

Time frame is open, I just bought a new toy that's being shipped in this weekend, I'll post pics when it arrives. Yes, it has a three pointed star on it.

As for the fiero, my friend who is helping me works for Napa and is my age, we were able to get into the Napa paint system from a home computer and have been reading their training guides and product information.

Napa paint is Sherwin Williams which seems to get pretty good reviews.

Napa also had some guns we were able to order at cost, we went middle of the road, not harbor freight but it was under $200 retail.

I'll be curious to see what kind of results we can produce, experience isn't on our side but time is, and we both care enough about paintwork we won't be making careless impatient mistakes.

We've removed the mirrors from the car, the sail windows, lights, I even have the windshield seal out.

I've got a spare fiero hood and a spare metal mercedes hood and a half dozen mangled fenders from benzes so we intended to ruin some throw away panels while we get used to hold the gun the right distance and trying to lay the paint right.

[Emc209i]

On large open sections, like the hood and decklid, block the surface before priming, and block the primer after it's dried. The DA sander can leave a surface that's not perfectly level, which will be plainly obvious in the end. Even though your clear coat will be blocked and smooth, the paint beneath it will play with reflections. Again, only on large surfaces where reflections will be most notable.

Urethane primer is the best to work with. Some brands are harder than others to sand.

Flex agent works like this... You add the agent to your material, and then you have a window of time to utilize the flex agent before it leaves the material. By the time the paint and clear coat are cured, there will be no flex agent left. The flex agent was designed for those painting a flexible bumper that needs to be contorted in order to reinstall it - IE Honda Civic. Urethane paint is notably flexible without any additive at all.

Painting everything on the car means you're going to have to be a tape wizard. It was nice with the panels off the car, because you can really lay the paint in areas that would be tricky if they were still on the spaceframe. Over spray is a bitch, areas you thought were airtight will defy the laws of the universe.

The primer is the easiest material to work with and is also the most flexible. Flex agent is really only for clear, but again, you don't need it.

There are plastic clips holding the door trim on. If they're original, there's no easy way of taking them off. Chances are they're going to break. FieroStore sells new clips. I'd just grab one end of the trim and yank. The fender trim is held in place by two plastic clips that have a nut on the back side of the fender.

I paid for two guns from Harbor Freight. I ruined the first two and returned them for replacements - save your gun's receipt. I've been through six guns thus far, all on the return policy of the first two guns. You may want to buy a very cheap gun to shoot your primer with, I found using the same gun for paint and clear didn't work out. There's no point in throwing down money for a really nice gun, until you have some experience. Sounds like your gun's a lot nicer than the one I used though. Gun quality becomes an issue when spraying pearls, candies, and metallics - solid colors are pretty straight forward, the clear just needs to be decent and everything can be sanded and polished.

Which Merc did you buy?

When my car was painted blue back in the day, we used Sherwin Williams paint. I like it a lot. The guys at the Sherwin Williams Automotive stores know their shit, and their paint systems are very to the point.

You say that time is on your side, but I don't think you understand what you're walking into yet. How much time do you really have? A year? Six months? I've got about 8 months into the cars outside, and I had help. It's hard work, esp when you're new to it.

Clear coat is the trickiest and most important thing to learn. I recommend spraying those practice pieces, let them cure, and try sanding and polishing before you begin. Lay as much clear as possible, the more safe area you have to sand, the better. You'll learn how not to spray dry clear, how to prevent runs, and time it takes for the clear to tack before laying another coat. It's really easy to mess up. Three hours of work can come to an end in seconds.

As for finishing products; 3m Perfect-It, compound, machine polish, and polish (stage 1 - 2 -3 ) are where it's at. Much better than Meguiar's, but the pads and bottles cost about $300. Get a good heavy duty polisher.

I'd rather stop now and let you dissolve a little bit. Lots more to go over, though. Any questions, feel free to ask.

[CincinnatiFiero]

I'll get on blocking the car, we ordered the primer, but I'll be out of town collecting my car this weekend so I probably won't get to starting to spray until early next week.

I bought another SL.

[Emc209i]

I bought another SL.

... which platform?

[CincinnatiFiero]

I'll post pictures Saturday.

I currently have an R107 1972 350SL, which I am keeping as well.

[Emc209i]

I was excited for a moment that you had found a nice R230.

[CincinnatiFiero]

I can afford an R230, I can't afford to maintain one. Same reason I do not have W211 E55K, if the airmatic completely shits out, the car will be parked for 6 months. You need to have 150% of the cash it takes to buy a 10 year old benz lol.

The car I bought is in some ways better, off to pick up the truck and trailer, leaving tonight at 2 am to be at a bank in St. Louis at 10am.

[Emc209i]

...leaving tonight at 2 am to be at a bank in St. Louis at 10am.

That's crazy, I was in St. Louis two months ago picking up this:





Check out Washington Ave. if you get a chance. Fun street.

[CincinnatiFiero]

1959 190SL

[The Dark Side of Will]

Daaaaaaaayum

[Emc209i]

Jesus Christ... what are you going to do with that, start a museum?

Would love to see more pictures. Very classy. Beautiful color.

[CincinnatiFiero]

Figured we'd jump over here

http://realfierotech.com/phpBB/viewtopi ... =9&t=17642

[CincinnatiFiero]

Got most of the materials, but I'm doing it with a friend and I don't think the next time we will have a common, whole weekend to build our booth and at least shoot primer will be until the 24th. So this is still in process, just my schedule slows it down.

[Emc209i]

Yup.

[Emc209i]

I just thought of a small detail that not many people talk about. Quality of sandpaper makes a huge difference. A single sheet of 3m will last longer than four sheets of Harbor Freight paper, and leave a much better surface. Finishing sandpapers (1000-3000) should be non less than 3M. I've also really enjoyed using Maguiers top of the line 2500 and 3000, which is supposed to wear evenly and provide a uniform cut.