The Mule rides again (sort of) - pics.

[The Dark Side of Will]

I had the first patch for the floorpan welded in and started driving the car again. I still have to drill all the spotwelds for the seat stud rail and replace that, but that will come.

Also been driving somewhat carefully as the right rear engine mount bracket is still out. I had the crack repaired and the bracket gusseted in multiple locations... now trying to strip the old/peeling powder coat off in order to replace with epoxy paint.

Fuel pump may be failing... but I don't think I'll be able to isolate it as such until I can get the O2 sensor volts and KR to report correctly in Torque.

Not sure why O2 sensor volts aren't being recorded, but you can add custom PIDs (like KR) for logging if they don't show up. Under 'Manage extra PIDs/Sensors', select the menu again and select 'Add custom PID'.

Where do I look up the location of KR in the data stream? Or get the correct locations for O2 sensor volts, for that matter? In order to add the custom PID, I need the address of the data in the stream.

[The Dark Side of Will]

I realized that when I had the floorpan welded, I didn't disconnect the computer or battery . I first noticed the random misfire problem after the welding session. I'm concerned that this may be causing my misfire, either via corruption of the flash memory or physical damage to the computer.

However, the driveability symptoms could also be caused by a failing fuel pump. While I can't come up with a credible failure mechanism for the welding to have caused a problem with the pump, the pump was installed 14 years ago and has been getting progressively noisier when warm. It's an OE C4 Corvette pump, not a Walbro.

I can't verify either one until I can log O2 voltage and KR. (Although I guess I could go for a drive with my fuel pressure gauge taped to the decklid and have my g/f read it while I hammer the throttle).

Edit: Started a topic on the Torque forum: http://torque-bhp.com/forums/?wpforumac ... c&t=3748.0

[The Dark Side of Will]

I have a ScanTool 426101 OBDLink MX Bluetooth/OBD-II Scan Tool Interface and a Nexus 7 (Android Tablet) with the Torque Pro app. I'll try to generate some logs this week from the Apocalypse Wagon and upload them to my website so you can see how it does.

I'm glad to hear it starts, runs, and idles. Concerning the tune, the one unknown for me was exactly what MAF sensor the Shelby used. I didn't have that information and I'm betting the MAF calibration is off in your tune for the MAF sensor you are using on your engine.

The open to closed loop transition hiccup is something I've experienced on a few 1998 3800 tunes and I'm not sure what is causing it. Using a 99 3800 OS on the same PCM and engine, the problem went away. Unfortunately, we only have one OS for the Shelby tune so some digging might be required to 1) first determine what is going on causing the hiccup and then 2) what needs to be done to correct the problem - if it can even be corrected.

I would really like to see some data from this 1st tune I made you based on the Shelby code. The absolute cheapest way to go would be the Android Torque Pro app and ELM OBD interface that I talked about in the thread I started on Old Europe. HOWEVER, I'm not sure this app is going to give use enhanced data PIDs for this Shelby OS. I don't have anything with the Shelby tune on it here at my shop to try it out on. At the very least, you are going to need the following data PIDs available MINIMUM to log no matter what you use to get data:

-MAF flow (gm/sec or Hz)
-MAP (kpa)
-ECT (coolant temp)
-RPM
-KR (knock retard)
-B1S1 & B2S1 O2 sensor voltage
-B1 Short & Long Term Fuel Trims
-B2 Short & Long Term Fuel Trims

Anything else is a bonus.

HP Tuners VCM Scanner should do the job. Not sure about anything else (including Torque Pro).

-ryan

Just getting Torque info into one place:
http://www.fiero.com/forum/Forum2/HTML/127485.html

http://torque-bhp.com/wiki/Plugins
https://play.google.com/store/apps/deta ... tskills.kd

Edit: From the description on the website, the "Knock Detector" plugin looks like crap.

[The Dark Side of Will]

My case halves are staying sealed, but I'm starting to think my oil manifold and/or pan seal may be leaking.
There's oil-based road grime all the way around the rim of the pan, but only as high as the pan and/or oil manifold joint.
If the oil manifold leaks at higher pressure, that would explain why I don't see any leaks while lying under the car when it's idling.

http://parts.nalleygmc.com/showAssembly ... gory=19398

http://parts.nalleygmc.com/products/Cad ... 81822.html

The oil manifold and associated parts are something of an interchangeability nightmare... I'll have to buy them one by one to make sure I get the right thing.

[The Dark Side of Will]

Couldn't get the software to do what I wanted, so I went ahead and pulled the plugs. Oil consumption caught up with them. CarQuest will have new ones for me this afternoon. I hope that fixes it... until I can get the oil cooler operating and the new crank installed.

It's frustrating that I finally have a tunable computer and STILL don't have the diagnostics to tell me what's wrong with the engine.

I've seen per cylinder misfire counters in Tech 2 readouts, but TorqueScan doesn't give me access to those with this data stream. Also don't have KR or raw knock counts. Grrr...

[Sinister Fiero]

Does TorquePro w/ TorqueScan give the 99-00 LS1 guys KR and per cylinder misfire data? Just wondering if the Shelby OS runs the same scan data output PID addresses as the LS1 OS (because I don't know).

[Shaun41178(2)]

new crank? whats the matter? what did I miss?

[The Dark Side of Will]

Does TorquePro w/ TorqueScan give the 99-00 LS1 guys KR and per cylinder misfire data? Just wondering if the Shelby OS runs the same scan data output PID addresses as the LS1 OS (because I don't know).

I don't know. I had assumed so since TorqueScan is supposed to have manufacturer specific extended PID's.

new crank? whats the matter? what did I miss?

The first crank shop screwed up the crank that's in the engine now. They cut the rod journals too small and the rod bearing clearance is about 0.003 when it could/should be 0.0017ish.

I believe this means there's too much oil in the crankcase form of droplets and crank windage.

When combined with high oil temperatures that reduce viscosity and make the oil thinner, I think the result is that there's too much oil on the bores that's too thin and some of it gets by the rings, leading to at least some of the car's oil consumption. That this happens is reinforced by the fact that the first set of plugs were heavily fouled. I *really* really hope that this isn't a bore finish problem... but this engine has never smoked. The first engine smoked like a chimney. I can't believe all the oil consumption is through the cylinders. There has to be leaking somewhere.

However, I've fixed all the leaking I could see from lying under the car as it idled.

There's oily grime all around the perimeter of the pan, but everything is dry above the oil pan to oil manifold plate joint. That could also be the oil manifold plate to block joint, as the manifold plate is only ~1/4" thick.
When I put the engine together the first time, I reused the old manifold plate. This may have been a mistake. The oil pan seal above where the exhaust passes under the block may also have been cooked... I need to drop the exhaust and pull the pan to determine exactly what's going on there. I guess I could start by checking the torque on the pan bolts...

The next step is to lie under the car while my dad or g/f hold the RPM at 2000-2500 and see if the higher oil pressure causes the manifold plate to leak.

[Sinister Fiero]

Run a full data PID scan thru TorqueScan by doing the following...

1) While connected to the PCM with the key on, open TorquePro
2) Click on the menu button on your android phone to bring up the popup menu within TorquePro
3) Click on SETTINGS
4) Select PLUGINS
5) Check the box next to "ALLOW PLUGINS FULL ACCESS" then close out of the settings menu.
6) Start TorqueScan
7) Click on the menu button on your android phone to bring up the popup menu within TorqueScan
8) Click on PID scanner
9) Click on the menu button on your android phone again to bring up the popup menu for the PID scanner
10) Click on START SCAN
11) Check the box next to the FULL SCAN option & leave "auto" as the entry in the "Enter header to use" field
12) Click on OK to start the full PID scan

After it gets to the point where it is no longer finding PIDs (it will say NO RESPONSE), you can cancel out of the PID scan by clicking the back button on your android phone.

I did this while hooked up to a 99 Shelby tuned PCM on my bench and it found Knock Retard and misfires and automatically added them to the TorqueScan PID list. I verified that I was getting valid data on these new PIDs so you should too.

[The Dark Side of Will]

Run a full data PID scan thru TorqueScan by doing the following...

1) While connected to the PCM with the key on, open TorquePro
2) Click on the menu button on your android phone to bring up the popup menu within TorquePro
3) Click on SETTINGS
4) Select PLUGINS
5) Check the box next to "ALLOW PLUGINS FULL ACCESS" then close out of the settings menu.
6) Start TorqueScan
7) Click on the menu button on your android phone to bring up the popup menu within TorqueScan
Click on PID scanner
9) Click on the menu button on your android phone again to bring up the popup menu for the PID scanner
10) Click on START SCAN
11) Check the box next to the FULL SCAN option & leave "auto" as the entry in the "Enter header to use" field
12) Click on OK to start the full PID scan

After it gets to the point where it is no longer finding PIDs (it will say NO RESPONSE), you can cancel out of the PID scan by clicking the back button on your android phone.

I did this while hooked up to a 99 Shelby tuned PCM on my bench and it found Knock Retard and misfires and automatically added them to the TorqueScan PID list. I verified that I was getting valid data on these new PIDs so you should too.

Ahh... ok. It boils down to operator error. I can probably get to this tomorrow.

Thanks!

[The Dark Side of Will]

I let it run for 3 hours and it wasn't finished.

Also got the remainder of the floor pan patch installed. Now I need to R&R the seat support channel.
Unfortunately I also discovered a crack in the floorpan right next to the structural location where the lower frame rail joins the firewall. Sigh.

Also had the failure to hot restart phenomenon yesterday on the way back from dad's to NoVA. It almost feels like vapor locking. When I got back to NoVA, I put the fuel pressure gauge on it and got one reading from a failed attempted start of about 25 psi, while the rest got up to 43 and started successfully.

The fuel pump does make a good bit of noise when it gets hot on an extended drive.
I need to look up the price of a new regulator assembly. I swapped my original regulator into the stainless fuel rail, so I'm still running with the old regulator.
The fuel pump is from a '96 'Vette.

[The Dark Side of Will]

Run a full data PID scan thru TorqueScan by doing the following...

1) While connected to the PCM with the key on, open TorquePro
2) Click on the menu button on your android phone to bring up the popup menu within TorquePro
3) Click on SETTINGS
4) Select PLUGINS
5) Check the box next to "ALLOW PLUGINS FULL ACCESS" then close out of the settings menu.
6) Start TorqueScan
7) Click on the menu button on your android phone to bring up the popup menu within TorqueScan
8) Click on PID scanner
9) Click on the menu button on your android phone again to bring up the popup menu for the PID scanner
10) Click on START SCAN
11) Check the box next to the FULL SCAN option & leave "auto" as the entry in the "Enter header to use" field
12) Click on OK to start the full PID scan

After it gets to the point where it is no longer finding PIDs (it will say NO RESPONSE), you can cancel out of the PID scan by clicking the back button on your android phone.

I did this while hooked up to a 99 Shelby tuned PCM on my bench and it found Knock Retard and misfires and automatically added them to the TorqueScan PID list. I verified that I was getting valid data on these new PIDs so you should too.

Did it.
Here's the result:

Code: Select all

Command: 2401 response:7F2401FFFF11
Command: 2402 response:7F2402FFFF11
Command: 2403 response:7F2403FFFF11
Command: 2404 response:7F2404FFFF11
Command: 2405 response:7F2405FFFF11
Command: 2406 response:7F2406FFFF11
Command: 2407 response:7F2407FFFF11
Scanning was cancelled
Command: 2408 response:7F2408FFFF11
Command: 2401 response:7F2401FFFF11
Command: 2402 response:7F2402FFFF11
Command: 2403 response:7F2403FFFF11
Command: 2404 response:7F2404FFFF11
Command: 2405 response:7F2405FFFF11
Command: 2406 response:7F2406FFFF11
Command: 2407 response:7F2407FFFF11
Command: 2408 response:7F2408FFFF11
Command: 2409 response:7F2409FFFF11
Command: 240a response:7F240AFFFF11
Command: 240b response:7F240BFFFF11
Command: 240c response:7F240CFFFF11
Command: 240d response:7F240DFFFF11
Command: 240e response:7F240EFFFF11
Command: 240f response:7F240FFFFF11
Command: 2410 response:7F2410FFFF11
Command: 2411 response:7F2411FFFF11
Command: 2412 response:7F2412FFFF11
Command: 2413 response:7F2413FFFF11
Command: 2414 response:7F2414FFFF11
Command: 2415 response:7F2415FFFF11
Command: 2416 response:7F2416FFFF11
Command: 2417 response:7F2417FFFF11
Command: 2418 response:7F2418FFFF11
Command: 2419 response:7F2419FFFF11
Command: 241a response:7F241AFFFF11
Command: 241b response:7F241BFFFF11
Command: 241c response:7F241CFFFF11
Command: 241d response:7F241DFFFF11
Command: 241e response:7F241EFFFF11
Command: 241f response:7F241FFFFF11
Command: 2100 response:7F210011
Command: 2101 response:7F210111
Command: 2102 response:7F210211
Command: 2103 response:7F210311
Command: 2104 response:7F210411
Command: 2105 response:7F210511
Command: 2106 response:7F210611
Command: 2107 response:7F210711
Command: 2108 response:7F210811
Command: 2109 response:7F210911
Command: 210a response:7F210A11
Command: 210b response:7F210B11
Command: 210c response:7F210C11
Command: 210d response:7F210D11
Command: 210e response:7F210E11
Command: 210f response:7F210F11
Command: 2110 response:7F211011
Command: 2111 response:7F211111
Command: 2112 response:7F211211
Command: 2113 response:7F211311
Command: 2114 response:7F211411
Command: 2115 response:7F211511
Command: 2116 response:7F211611
Command: 2117 response:7F211711
Command: 2118 response:7F211811
Command: 2119 response:7F211911
Command: 211a response:7F211A11
Command: 211b response:7F211B11
Command: 211c response:7F211C11
Command: 211d response:7F211D11
Command: 211e response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 211f response:7F211F11
Command: 2120 response:7F212011
Command: 2121 response:7F212111
Command: 2122 response:7F212211
Command: 2123 response:7F212311
Command: 2124 response:7F212411
Command: 2125 response:7F212511
Command: 2126 response:7F212611
Command: 2127 response:7F212711
Command: 2128 response:7F212811
Command: 2129 response:7F212911
Command: 212a response:7F212A11
Command: 212b response:7F212B11
Command: 212c response:7F212C11
Command: 212d response:7F212D11
Command: 212e response:7F212E11
Command: 212f response:7F212F11
Command: 2130 response:7F213011
Command: 2131 response:7F213111
Command: 2132 response:7F213211
Command: 2133 response:7F213311
Command: 2134 response:7F213411
Command: 2135 response:7F213511
Command: 2136 response:7F213611
Command: 2137 response:7F213711
Command: 2138 response:7F213811
Command: 2139 response:7F213911
Command: 213a response:7F213A11
Command: 213b response:7F213B11
Command: 213c response:7F213C11
Command: 213d response:7F213D11
Command: 213e response:7F213E11
Command: 213f response:7F213F11
Command: 2140 response:7F214011
Command: 2141 response:7F214111
Command: 2142 response:7F214211
Command: 2143 response:7F214311
Command: 2144 response:7F214411
Command: 2145 response:7F214511
Command: 2146 response:7F214611
Command: 2147 response:7F214711
Command: 2148 response:7F214811
Command: 2149 response:7F214911
Command: 214a response:7F214A11
Command: 214b response:7F214B11
Command: 214c response:7F214C11
Command: 214d response:7F214D11
Command: 214e response:7F214E11
Command: 214f response:7F214F11
Command: 2150 response:7F215011
Command: 2151 response:7F215111
Command: 2152 response:7F215211
Command: 2153 response:7F215311
Command: 2154 response:7F215411
Command: 2155 response:7F215511
Command: 2156 response:7F215611
Command: 2157 response:7F215711
Command: 2158 response:7F215811
Command: 2159 response:7F215911
Command: 215a response:7F215A11
Command: 215b response:7F215B11
Command: 215c response:7F215C11
Command: 215d response:7F215D11
Command: 215e response:7F215E11
Command: 215f response:7F215F11
Command: 2160 response:7F216011
Command: 2161 response:7F216111
Command: 2162 response:7F216211
Command: 2163 response:7F216311
Command: 2164 response:7F216411
Command: 2165 response:7F216511
Command: 2166 response:7F216611
Command: 2167 response:7F216711
Command: 2168 response:7F216811
Command: 2169 response:7F216911
Command: 216a response:7F216A11
Command: 216b response:7F216B11
Command: 216c response:7F216C11
Command: 216d response:7F216D11
Command: 216e response:7F216E11
Command: 216f response:7F216F11
Command: 2170 response:7F217011
Command: 2171 response:7F217111
Command: 2172 response:7F217211
Command: 2173 response:7F217311
Command: 2174 response:7F217411
Command: 2175 response:7F217511
Command: 2176 response:7F217611
Command: 2177 response:7F217711
Command: 2178 response:7F217811
Command: 2179 response:7F217911
Command: 217a response:7F217A11
Command: 217b response:7F217B11
Command: 217c response:7F217C11
Command: 217d response:7F217D11
Command: 217e response:7F217E11
Command: 217f response:7F217F11
Command: 2180 response:7F218011
Command: 2181 response:7F218111
Command: 2182 response:7F218211
Command: 2183 response:7F218311
Command: 2184 response:7F218411
Command: 2185 response:7F218511
Command: 2186 response:7F218611
Command: 2187 response:7F218711
Command: 2188 response:7F218811
Command: 2189 response:7F218911
Command: 218a response:7F218A11
Command: 218b response:7F218B11
Command: 218c response:7F218C11
Command: 218d response:7F218D11
Command: 218e response:7F218E11
Command: 218f response:7F218F11
Command: 2190 response:7F219011
Command: 2191 response:7F219111
Command: 2192 response:7F219211
Command: 2193 response:7F219311
Command: 2194 response:7F219411
Command: 2195 response:7F219511
Command: 2196 response:7F219611
Command: 2197 response:7F219711
Command: 2198 response:7F219811
Command: 2199 response:7F219911
Command: 219a response:7F219A11
Command: 219b response:7F219B11
Command: 219c response:7F219C11
Command: 219d response:7F219D11
Command: 219e response:7F219E11
Command: 219f response:7F219F11
Command: 21a0 response:7F21A011
Command: 21a1 response:7F21A111
Command: 21a2 response:7F21A211
Command: 21a3 response:7F21A311
Command: 21a4 response:7F21A411
Command: 21a5 response:7F21A511
Command: 21a6 response:7F21A611
Command: 21a7 response:7F21A711
Command: 21a8 response:7F21A811
Command: 21a9 response:7F21A911
Command: 21aa response:7F21AA11
Command: 21ab response:7F21AB11
Command: 21ac response:7F21AC11
Command: 21ad response:7F21AD11
Command: 21ae response:7F21AE11
Command: 21af response:7F21AF11
Command: 21b0 response:7F21B011
Command: 21b1 response:7F21B111
Command: 21b2 response:7F21B211
Command: 21b3 response:7F21B311
Command: 21b4 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 21b5 response:7F21B511
Command: 21b6 response:7F21B611
Command: 21b7 response:7F21B711
Command: 21b8 response:7F21B811
Command: 21b9 response:7F21B911
Command: 21ba response:7F21BA11
Command: 21bb response:7F21BB11
Command: 21bc response:7F21BC11
Command: 21bd response:7F21BD11
Command: 21be response:7F21BE11
Command: 21bf response:7F21BF11
Command: 21c0 response:7F21C011
Command: 21c1 response:7F21C111
Command: 21c2 response:7F21C211
Command: 21c3 response:7F21C311
Command: 21c4 response:7F21C411
Command: 21c5 response:7F21C511
Command: 21c6 response:7F21C611
Command: 21c7 response:7F21C711
Command: 21c8 response:7F21C811
Command: 21c9 response:7F21C911
Command: 21ca response:7F21CA11
Command: 21cb response:7F21CB11
Command: 21cc response:7F21CC11
Command: 21cd response:7F21CD11
Command: 21ce response:7F21CE11
Command: 21cf response:7F21CF11
Command: 21d0 response:7F21D011
Command: 21d1 response:7F21D111
Command: 21d2 response:7F21D211
Command: 21d3 response:7F21D311
Command: 21d4 response:7F21D411
Command: 21d5 response:7F21D511
Command: 21d6 response:7F21D611
Command: 21d7 response:7F21D711
Command: 21d8 response:7F21D811
Command: 21d9 response:7F21D911
Command: 21da response:7F21DA11
Command: 21db response:7F21DB11
Command: 21dc response:7F21DC11
Command: 21dd response:7F21DD11
Command: 21de response:7F21DE11
Command: 21df response:7F21DF11
Command: 21e0 response:7F21E011
Command: 21e1 response:7F21E111
Command: 21e2 response:7F21E211
Command: 21e3 response:7F21E311
Command: 21e4 response:7F21E411
Command: 21e5 response:7F21E511
Command: 21e6 response:7F21E611
Command: 21e7 response:7F21E711
Command: 21e8 response:7F21E811
Command: 21e9 response:7F21E911
Command: 21ea response:7F21EA11
Command: 21eb response:7F21EB11
Command: 21ec response:7F21EC11
Command: 21ed response:7F21ED11
Command: 21ee response:7F21EE11
Command: 21ef response:7F21EF11
Command: 21f0 response:7F21F011
Command: 21f1 response:7F21F111
Command: 21f2 response:7F21F211
Command: 21f3 response:7F21F311
Command: 21f4 response:7F21F411
Command: 21f5 response:7F21F511
Command: 21f6 response:7F21F611
Command: 21f7 response:7F21F711
Command: 21f8 response:7F21F811
Command: 21f9 response:7F21F911
Command: 21fa response:7F21FA11
Command: 21fb response:7F21FB11
Command: 21fc response:7F21FC11
Command: 21fd response:7F21FD11
Command: 21fe response:7F21FE11
Command: 220001 response:62000104076500
Command: 220003 response:6200030202
Command: 220004 response:6200040E
Command: 220005 response:6200057E
Command: 220006 response:6200067B
Command: 220007 response:6200077D
Command: 220008 response:62000883
Command: 220009 response:62000984
Command: 22000b response:62000B21
Command: 22000c response:62000C1CEB
Command: 22000d response:62000D1B
Command: 22000e response:62000EC0
Command: 22000f response:62000F49
Command: 220010 response:6200100659
Command: 220011 response:6200110D
Command: 220012 response:62001204
Command: 220013 response:62001333
Command: 220014 response:6200141980
Command: 220015 response:62001559FF
Command: 220016 response:62001659FF
Command: 220018 response:6200182080
Command: 220019 response:62001959FF
Command: 22001c response:62001C01
Command: 22001e response:62001E00
Command: 220240 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 2205b8 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 220778 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 220ff7 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 22102e response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 221100 response:6211008B
Command: 221101 response:62110102
Command: 221102 response:6211025C
Command: 221103 response:62110334
Command: 221104 response:62110464
Command: 221105 response:62110527
Command: 221106 response:62110609
Command: 221107 response:62110709
Command: 22110a response:62110A00
Command: 22110b response:62110B42
Command: 22110c response:62110C00
Command: 22110d response:62110D23
Command: 22110e response:62110E00
Command: 22110f response:62110F7F
Command: 221110 response:62111000
Command: 221111 response:6211116E
Command: 221112 response:62111200
Command: 221113 response:62111308
Command: 221114 response:62111400
Command: 221115 response:62111500
Command: 221116 response:62111600
Command: 221117 response:62111788
Command: 221118 response:62111801
Command: 221119 response:62111900
Command: 221120 response:62112050
Command: 221140 response:62114003A5
Command: 221141 response:6211417B
Command: 221142 response:62114242
Command: 221143 response:62114319
Command: 221144 response:62114400
Command: 221145 response:6211450F
Command: 221146 response:62114668
Command: 221148 response:62114825
Command: 221149 response:62114967
Command: 22114b response:62114B00
Command: 22114d response:62114D00
Command: 22114e response:62114E01
Command: 221151 response:62115100
Command: 221152 response:62115200
Command: 221155 response:621155FF
Command: 22115c response:62115C01
Command: 22116f response:62116F68
Command: 221170 response:62117038
Command: 221172 response:621172004C
Command: 221177 response:6211774D
Command: 221190 response:62119012
Command: 221192 response:62119248
Command: 22119b response:62119B00
Command: 22119d response:62119DEC
Command: 22119f response:62119F45
Command: 2211a1 response:6211A10287
Command: 2211a6 response:6211A600
Command: 2211bb response:6211BB4D
Command: 2211bd response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 2211be response:6211BE1554
Command: 2211bf response:6211BF1500
Command: 2211c0 response:6211C00C00
Command: 2211c1 response:6211C100
Command: 2211c2 response:6211C200
Command: 2211c4 response:6211C40C00
Command: 2211d7 response:6211D7000A
Command: 2211e4 response:6211E40000
Command: 2211e5 response:6211E50153
Command: 2211e6 response:6211E60000
Command: 2211e7 response:6211E701
Command: 2211e8 response:6211E801F4
Command: 2211e9 response:6211E9FF
Command: 2211ea response:6211EA00
Command: 2211eb response:6211EB00
Command: 2211ec response:6211EC00
Command: 2211ed response:6211ED00
Command: 2211f2 response:6211F200
Command: 2211f3 response:6211F300
Command: 2211f4 response:6211F400
Command: 2211f5 response:6211F500
Command: 2211f6 response:6211F600
Command: 2211f7 response:6211F700
Command: 2211f8 response:6211F80000
Command: 2211f9 response:6211F90000
Command: 2211fa response:6211FA0000
Command: 2211fb response:6211FB0000
Command: 221200 response:62120000
Command: 221201 response:6212010000
Command: 221202 response:6212020000
Command: 221203 response:6212030000
Command: 221204 response:6212040000
Command: 221205 response:62120500
Command: 221206 response:62120600
Command: 221207 response:62120700
Command: 221208 response:62120800
Command: 22120a response:62120A7F
Command: 22120b response:62120B78
Command: 22120c response:62120C7B
Command: 221212 response:62121200
Command: 221216 response:621216000C
Command: 221217 response:621217000D
Command: 22121a response:62121A0009
Command: 22121c response:62121C67
Command: 22121d response:62121D65
Command: 221221 response:6212210000
Command: 221226 response:62122665
Command: 221227 response:6212270000
Command: 221228 response:6212280000
Command: 221229 response:6212290B9E
Command: 22122a response:62122A00
Command: 221232 response:62123200
Command: 221233 response:62123300
Command: 221234 response:621234034C
Command: 221235 response:621235005C
Command: 221236 response:621236006A
Command: 221237 response:62123702
Command: 221238 response:62123801
Command: 221239 response:62123901
Command: 22123a response:62123A7F
Command: 22123c response:62123C66
Command: 22123d response:62123D0000
Command: 221243 response:6212430000
Command: 221244 response:6212440000
Command: 221245 response:6212450000
Command: 221246 response:6212460000
Command: 221247 response:62124700
Command: 221250 response:62125019F7
Command: 221255 response:62125500B8
Command: 221257 response:6212570014
Command: 221258 response:6212580000
Command: 221259 response:6212590028
Command: 22125a response:62125A00F5
Command: 22125b response:62125B00FC
Command: 221296 response:6212960000
Command: 2212b0 response:6212B000
Command: 2212b1 response:6212B10000
Command: 2212c5 response:6212C500
Command: 2212e3 response:6212E300
Command: 2212ea response:6212EA00
Command: 2212eb response:6212EB00
Command: 2212ed response:6212ED01
Command: 2212ee response:6212EE00
Command: 2212ef response:6212EF00
Command: 2212f0 response:6212F000
Command: 2212f5 response:6212F50452
Command: 2212f7 response:6212F726
Command: 2212ff response:6212FF11F6
Command: 221300 response:6213000452
Command: 22130e response:62130E0450
Command: 22130f response:62130F02
Command: 221310 response:62131002
Command: 221311 response:62131100
Command: 221312 response:62131202
Command: 221315 response:6213150C
Command: 221316 response:6213160C
Command: 221317 response:6213170C
Command: 221318 response:6213180C
Command: 221319 response:6213190C
Command: 22131a response:62131A0C
Command: 22131b response:62131B0C
Command: 22131c response:62131C0C
Command: 22131d response:62131D12C0
Command: 22131e response:62131E0000
Command: 22131f response:62131F0000
Command: 22132a response:62132A0000
Command: 221336 response:6213365000
Command: 221337 response:6213370466
Command: 221338 response:621338FF
Command: 2214a8 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 2215b2 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 221612 response:621612FFFF
Command: 221613 response:6216130000
Command: 221614 response:6216146A37
Command: 221615 response:6216150000
Command: 221617 response:6216171D6C
Command: 221618 response:6216180E10
Command: 221619 response:6216190000
Command: 2217e5 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 221847 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 221900 response:62190001
Command: 221901 response:62190100
Command: 221921 response:62192108
Command: 221922 response:62192201
Command: 221923 response:62192300
Command: 221924 response:62192420
Command: 221925 response:62192500
Command: 221927 response:62192700
Command: 221928 response:62192800
Command: 221929 response:62192900
Command: 22192a response:62192A30
Command: 22192b response:62192B0000
Command: 22192d response:62192D04
Command: 221937 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 221940 response:62194028
Command: 221941 response:6219410000
Command: 221942 response:6219420000
Command: 22195d response:62195D0000
Command: 221970 response:62197000
Command: 221971 response:62197100
Command: 221972 response:62197200
Command: 221973 response:62197300
Command: 221991 response:6219910000
Command: 221992 response:62199200
Command: 221993 response:62199300
Command: 221994 response:62199400
Command: 221995 response:62199500
Command: 221996 response:62199600
Command: 221997 response:62199700
Command: 221998 response:62199800
Command: 221999 response:62199900
Command: 22199a response:62199A00
Command: 22199b response:62199B00
Command: 22199c response:62199C00
Command: 22199d response:62199D00
Command: 22199e response:62199E00
Command: 22199f response:62199F00
Command: 2219a0 response:6219A000
Command: 2219a1 response:6219A100
Command: 2219ad response:6219ADFF
Command: 2219d4 response:6219D40000
Command: 2219de response:6219DE0000
Command: 2219ff response:6219FF00
Command: 221a02 response:621A020000
Command: 221a13 response:621A1300
Command: 221a71 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 221d33 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 221d92 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 221dcc response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 221e4f response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 22226f response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 222423 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 222d36 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 222ddd response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 2234d8 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 2238f9 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 2239f8 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 223a01 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 223b77 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 2243d9 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 2245e2 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 224822 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 2248b3 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 2249de response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 224c08 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 224c31 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 224c74 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 224caf response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 22501e response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 2257d4 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 225932 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 225bce response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 225f9b response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 22645a response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 226490 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 226ac6 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 226ad9 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 226b4e response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 226c3c response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 226c83 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 2273d2 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 227495 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 227517 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 2278bd response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 2278e8 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 227b8f response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 2280da response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 228227 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 22840f response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 228551 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 228c1c response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 228e69 response:<DATA ERROR
Command: 22fc12 response:62FC123A83
Command: 22fc1c response:62FC1C083B
Command: 22fc1e response:62FC1E0195
Command: 22fc22 response:62FC220000
Command: 22fc24 response:62FC240000
Command: 22fc25 response:62FC250175
Command: 22fc2c response:62FC2C0132
Command: 22fc30 response:62FC300000
Command: 22fc40 response:62FC400000
Command: 22fc41 response:62FC410000
Command: 22fc43 response:62FC430000
Command: 22fc45 response:62FC4500
Command: 22fc46 response:62FC4600
Command: 22fc4a response:62FC4A00000384
Scanning finished

It never got to "no response".
Also, I do NOT have any additional PID's available in my list of PID's for logging.
Do I need to restart Android or something silly?

[Sinister Fiero]

Interesting, my scanning session ran for more than an hour and I had to cancel out of it or I don't think it would have ever finished. Are you sure you selected the FULL PID SCAN option checkbox when you did this? (the one that has a notation that says it could take a VERY LONG TIME to do?)

You did do this PID scan while in the TorqueScan plug-in of the TorquePro program, didn't you?

[The Dark Side of Will]

Yes to all of the above.

What version of Torque/TorqueScan do you have?

[Sinister Fiero]

Standby for a few - I'm going to hook back up to my bench Shelby tuned PCM and get the hex addresses for the KR and misfire PIDs.

[Sinister Fiero]

Knock Retard: 2211a6

Misfire Cyl.1 Current: 221205
Misfire Cyl.1 History: 221201
Misfire Cyl.2 Current: 221206
Misfire Cyl.2 History: 221202
Misfire Cyl.3 Current: 221207
Misfire Cyl.3 History: 221203
Misfire Cyl.4 Current: 221208
Misfire Cyl.4 History: 221204
Misfire Cyl.5 Current: 2211ea
Misfire Cyl.5 History: 2211f8
Misfire Cyl.6 Current: 2211eb
Misfire Cyl.6 History: 2211f9
Misfire Cyl.7 Current: 2211ec
Misfire Cyl.7 History: 2211fa
Misfire Cyl.8 Current: 2211ed
Misfire Cyl.8 History: 2211fb

I'm running TorquePro v1.6.58
I'm running TorqueScan v1.5

[The Dark Side of Will]

From my scan data above:

KR:
Command: 2211a6 response:6211A600

Cyl 1-4 misfire history
Command: 221201 response:6212010000
Command: 221202 response:6212020000
Command: 221203 response:6212030000
Command: 221204 response:6212040000

Cyl 1-4 misfire current
Command: 221205 response:62120500
Command: 221206 response:62120600
Command: 221207 response:62120700
Command: 221208 response:62120800

Cyl 5-8 misfire current
Command: 2211ea response:6211EA00
Command: 2211eb response:6211EB00
Command: 2211ec response:6211EC00
Command: 2211ed response:6211ED00

Cyl 5-8 misfire history
Command: 2211f8 response:6211F80000
Command: 2211f9 response:6211F90000
Command: 2211fa response:6211FA0000
Command: 2211fb response:6211FB0000

Misfire history are 16 bit counters, while current are 8 bit... that's about all I can discover

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OBD-II_PIDs

I think that the 6 at the beginning of the response indicates a Mode $06 interaction

Do you also show raw knock counts?

Thanks!

[Sinister Fiero]

From my scan data above:


Do you also show raw knock counts?

Thanks!

No, just says Knock Retard: 0 deg

[The Dark Side of Will]

Have not added the extended PID's yet.

I DID get the gusseted right rear engine mount bracket reinstalled. In typical Fiero fashion, it was a total B@#$% to reinstall, after being fairly easy to remove. It's SOOOOO nice to be able to hammer the throttle again.

I had another hot/no-restart incident out running errands this afternoon. I had my fuel pressure gauge in the trunk and was able to set it up so I could see it in the mirror from the driver's seat while cranking. Pressure fluctuated slightly, but stayed at 43ish.

The symptom is that when attempting restart about 5 minutes after a hot shutdown, it sputters for about half a second then stops trying to fire at all and just cranks. If allowed to cool with the decklid open for 5-10 minutes, it starts back up as normal.

To me that seemed like textbook vapor lock symptoms. However, I would expect to see fuel pressure drop if it were vapor locking. Fuel pressure stays up when cranking.

My next guess would be crank sensors; however those are essentially new. They only have a few thousand miles on them. Crank sensors aren't usually so responsive to cooling either. I also have an essentially new ICM. Torque reports ~100 RPM while cranking, so I know the ECM is getting trigger signals. I have not stethoscoped the injectors while doing this... I guess I could toss my stethoscope in the trunk too.

I *AM* still running a used set of coils. It might be time to look at a new set of those. The coils, like the fuel rail, are on top of the engine and thus subject to high ambient temps. They are mounted to the rear cam cover and a LOT of heat comes up the trunk wall from my custom rear manifold, so they probably get pretty intense exposure to that. They also should cool quickly once the decklid is open, so a coil problem would be responsive to cooling. Hmm....

However, I need to see what the misfire counts say...

[Aaron]

Where are you taking your fuel pressure reading from? It also sounds classic vapor lock to me, especially with how common that is on these.