Difficulty of Northstar swap?

[Fast88Fiero]

I'm wondering how much more is involved in doing a 4.6 Northstar V8 motor compared to a 4.9 swap? I would be useing a 5 speed manual transmission (getrag). What needs to be done for a flywheel and mounts? I know how to do wireing, that wont be a problem. Just trying to figure out why everyone says this swap is "hard".

And no, I'm not going to replace my 4 . 9. Might be doing a Northstar in a different Fiero. :bootyshake:

[Shaun41178(2)]

I can't compare to a 4.0 swap but I will say the n star swap is not that difficult to do. I have some experience helping put Jon's in.

You can use a Aftermarket aluminum flywheel from spec or have a flywheel redrilled.

Mounts are just like any other engine swap. You need to bolt the engine and tranny togethor, level it, and then build mounts around that. If you have a welder and some steel you can do it.

People say the swap is hard because they are mechanically challened. Its not a hard swap at all. People get all mind boggled over the wiring but thats a peice of cake really. Spend the money and do it right. GEt a standalone computer.

Thats the thing. Fiero people for the most part want a n star but dont' want to pay to have one installed. SO they aren't going to shell out the $1600 for a standalone but then they bitch about all the wiring problems they are having. Hell people have enough probs with the 4.9 swap and its wiring and now they want to do a n star with 8 times as much wiring? Bwahhaha ok!

Its not a hard swap. Its time consuming and expensive as shit if you do it right.

Just ask Jon. He has quite a bit of money in his swap. He is pretty much done though. And it will probably be one of the best swaps out there too, because he bought the right parts the first time.

Be prepared to spend $4k easy if you want to do it right.

[THE PUNISHER]

lets see... all prices converted to CDN

-Northstar $2000
-Stand Alone CHRFAB 950 $1900
-Spec Stage 3 Clutch $375
-Spec Aluminum Flywheel $500
-Getrag $300
-Rebuild or getrag $700
-Rodney's shift kinkage $500 (conversion kit since i used a cavalier tranny)
-Dynomax Mufflers $108 for the pair
-4 mandrel bent U joints $125 incl shipping
-Various pipes, hoses , clamps Wires ,fluid bolts $400 ..yes $400
-Not needed , but something that makes life a lot easier ..Gauges

-Autometer electic Fuel press , oil temp , oil press , water temp , AF ratio and nitrous pressure $500ish

Thats pretty much allI can think of , I could add int he koni's , coilovers , swaybars , big brakes and probably add another $3000 tothe car , but it'snot needed. My advice , just do the basics and get it running. Don't start extra projects mid way through. Just get it running

Also have but not listed $1000 in Cams and springs , heads worth $1000 (ported) Z06 Injectors $380..

[Fast88Fiero]

It basically sounds like my 4.9 swap with 3 more cams and some more wireing. The 4.9 swap was easy so I'm sure a northstar wouldnt be too bad. I wonder how good a stand alone would do on my 4.9. Would probably be better than my burned chip. Would defenatly make it easier to turbo in the future.

[crzyone]

The major advantage of the N* is its additional 3 cams.

N* has the ability to make crazy NA hp. With chrfabs mild cams, springs and retainers the motor is good for approx 370hp at the flywheel. This combo is also good for around 8000rpm. It has a bottom end that can support 10,000rpm. Under boost, the engine really shines. chrfab has made 2000hp alcohol fed twin turbo N*s, on the stock block and heads.

Its probibly the most exotic engine GM has ever put into a production car, the 4.9 has no advantages over it, sept maybe fuel economy.

If I had to choose between a stock N* or a boosted 4.9, I'd take the N*.

[eHoward]

Twice the cams equals twice the powa! :blah5:

The major advantage of the N* is its additional 3 cams.

N* has the ability to make crazy NA hp. \

[Fast88Fiero]

The major advantage of the N* is its additional 3 cams.

N* has the ability to make crazy NA hp. With chrfabs mild cams, springs and retainers the motor is good for approx 370hp at the flywheel. This combo is also good for around 8000rpm. It has a bottom end that can support 10,000rpm. Under boost, the engine really shines. chrfab has made 2000hp alcohol fed twin turbo N*s, on the stock block and heads.

Its probibly the most exotic engine GM has ever put into a production car, the Peice of shit has no advantages over it, sept maybe fuel economy.

If I had to choose between a stock N* or a boosted Peice of shit, I'd take the N*.

I agree with you, but I didnt ask the advantages of the Northstar over the 4 . 9. I was asking how hard the swap is and what all is involved. I am not replacing my 4 . 9 with a northstar, it will be a swap into a different car. I am doing plenty of mods to the 4 . 9 as we speak that should help it out a lot. The last thing I'm worried about in my Fiero is fuel economy. :la: I really want to see what I can get out of my 4 . 9, then it's going to be either a northstar or a 3.4DOHC into another Fiero. Besides, I like my 4 . 9 because everyone else hates it. :thumbleft:

[crzyone]

I had a 4. 9 That was back in the days guys were claiming it was putting their fieros in the mid 13s. I put about $2500 into the conversion before I learned the truth. I then sold my 4.9 and an 85GT at a huge loss.
http://www.fiero.com/forum/Archives/Arch ... 27839.html

Since then I had a 383 stroker, and an LT1. I finally settled on my 3.4dohc. The plan was to turbocharge it to around 400hp.

If you are looking for an easy swap, do the 3.4dohc. I think it is the easiest swap other than a pushrod 3.4 Total time to install mine was probibly a week, but it took me a couple months waiting on parts to get it on the road.

[Fast88Fiero]

I found out how slow the 4 . 9 was in the middle of my swap also. I finished it anyway for a couple of reasons. I knew I would mod it which will make it faster and I was useing a 5 speed transmission. 99% of the people who do the swap dont know shit. They put the auto trans in with it and dont even bother to get a chip burned so it's not in limp home mode. Not only that but they cut every corner while doing the swap because they dont want to spend money. After I got it running I was happy with it. It pulls really good off the line. I would beat my friends 3800SC car off the line, but at speed (50) he would be next to/past me. It does run out of breath at higher RPM and isnt that fast at higher speeds but after taking it apart for some mods I can see why. The intake and exhaust ports on the head are extremely restrictive. The 4.9 intake manifold sucks too. I've now ported my heads which made the intake and exhaust ports about 150% bigger (gasket matching the ports) and I'm adding the Allante intake manifold which is a lot less restrictive than the 4.9 intake manifold. That should help the engine breathe better at higher RPM and speed. We'll see. I wish I would have gotten some dyno runs in before modding it.

I might end up doing a 3.4 DOHC Swap sometime soon. A friend of mine wants me to install one in his 88 Fiero. That seems like a really nice swap for the Fiero.
:thumbleft:

[Shaun41178(2)]

start a thread and post pics fucker!!!

[Fast88Fiero]

start a thread and post pics fucker!!!

"Posts about Tractor motors will not be allowed" :scratch: :la:

[Shaun41178(2)]

God damnit I got owned.

[Shaun41178(2)]

99% of the people who do the swap dont know shit. They put the auto trans in with it and dont even bother to get a chip burned so it's not in limp home mode. Not only that but they cut every corner while doing the swap because they dont want to spend money. After I got it running I was happy with it.

And not only that, it seems those people are in a contest to see who can do it the cheapest, not to see who can do it the best.

I swear its all about doing shit cheaply over there and not doing it right. Sure you can throw the engine in for $600 including the price of the car and all that jazz, but will it be a nice swap and be quick? NO! Do people automatically think it will be because its a v8? YES. Thats the shit that pisses me off. People LOVE to brag about how cheap they did it for. But you never see anyone say it cost $3k to do but hey its done right and now it runs mid 13's. Everyone does it on the cheap, it runs 15's, then says they did it for that "v8 rumble"

Uh huh, sure pal.

Cutting corners all the time is just gay. Those people over there are notorius for it. ITS FUCKING GHEY!!!

[Fast88Fiero]

Yep. I didnt cut corners on mine and it was still pretty cheap. I'm putting more money into it now to make it faster too. I dont understand why people dont just do things right. It's retarded.

[AkursedX]

Shaun, here's the perfect example of what you're talking about. This fucking epitomizes the typical cheap fiero owner.


http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayI ... 96934&rd=1

Sad thing is that it's worse than a Piece of Shit, it's a goddamn 4.1!!

[AkursedX]

. But you never see anyone say it cost $3k to do but hey its done right and now it runs mid 13's.

There's a few reasons for that. #1 being the extremely small minorty of fiero-owners who actually do it the right way. #2 Because when people start talking about how much they spent doing a quality swap, you always get a bunch of retards posting about how they could have built the same car for $30, a bottlecap, and some glue.

[crzyone]

My 4. 9 engine cost me $1000
Gasket kit $400
rebuild heads $350
Waterpump $75
Timing chain $50

I felt it was necessary to spend money on a junkyard motor instead of just throwing it in the car and calling it good. The motor had unknown mileage so I felt I needed to pull the heads and pan anyways. Found it still had good crosshatching and no ring wear on the cylinder wall. Since the motor was alittle dirty from leaking oil, I bought a felpro gasket kit for $300 but it didn't come with a timing cover or oilpan gasket ($100 extra from GM)

I would have been confident with the motor after I rebuilt the top end and re-sealed the engine. Back when I had the motor there wasn't really anyone out there that was modifying them. Now that I look back, I wish I would have kept it and followed Rockcrawl's example. He is running low 13s and he didn't have to spend a pile of money to do it. New valve springs, roller rockers, shaved heads, new cam with a mustang 5.0 profile regrind. Not sure if he ported the heads, but I assume he did.

A low 13 NA 4. 9 would be cool. Throw a 100 shot on it and run 12s all day long. The motor its self is strong, PJB has shown us that. Its not that he's making a ton of power, but he has a lot of runs on the 1/4 mile and hasn't had a failure yet.

So, there is nothing wrong with a 4. 9 if people spend some money on it and get V-8 performance out of it. Fast88Fiero, you're doing it the right way. You shoud post some build pictures. Show the people on Old Europe how to do it properly.

[GmetalGT]

My swap is over $4k right now not including Labor. But I have replaced everything to make it like new. Put it this way. If something came off, it was replaced with a new part. The only sad part is that, I spent all this money and still havent driven it yet. However, Fast88did the same swap as me and is done months before. :scratch: Hmmmm

[Fast88Fiero]

My swap is over $4k right now not including Labor. But I have replaced everything to make it like new. Put it this way. If something came off, it was replaced with a new part. The only sad part is that, I spent all this money and still havent driven it yet. However, Fast88did the same swap as me and is done months before. :scratch: Hmmmm

If you lived closer to Michigan I would finish it for you. It's complete BS that your car isnt finished and running yet. It will be worth it when it's finished.

[eHoward]

I dont know MTA, but I know Jon Lagler. If you brought the car to Jon, it would have been done by now and it would have been done right .. . if you do serious work to your car again, it would be worth the trouble to bring it up to PA to have him do the modications.

I will vouch for Jon as being the best fiero mechanic/engineer I have seen and I dont say that lightly.

My swap is over $4k right now not including Labor. But I have replaced everything to make it like new. Put it this way. If something came off, it was replaced with a new part. The only sad part is that, I spent all this money and still havent driven it yet. However, Fast88did the same swap as me and is done months before. :scratch: Hmmmm