I'm running a 4T65HD trans in my car, a tranny that seems to be very picky about fluid level. If the level of the fluid gets too low, it will fail to shift until about 4200 rpm, not really cool for lugging around town. So, I keep track of the level, but I also get the same issue if I'm stuck in traffic or in a drive thru, for example. I'm wondering if this is anyway temperature related.
I've looked at transmission coolers, and they seem to be for towing. Is there any added benefit to be gained by a car not under a tow load using a transmission cooler? Any recommendations?
Will a transmission cooler benefit?
Moderators: The Dark Side of Will, Series8217
So do you think sitting at idle is bringing the tranny fluid up to high temps? I mean, of course you can't be too rich or too thin, and I suppose your tranny fluid can't be too cool, but is the expense and fabrication of mounting an external tranny cooler going to be worth the effort?
Any other opinions?
Any other opinions?
-
Shaun41178(2)
- Posts: 8368
- Joined: Fri Nov 19, 2004 7:12 pm
- Location: Ben Phelps is an alleged scammer
Tranny temps dont' really rise while sitting. Its under hard driving where the car is being pushed. Also multiple gear changes like from 2nd to 3rd and back down to second. sort of like being on a road course.
Thats what brings tranny temps up pretty high. Normal driving won't overheat the fluid.
if you drive normal most of the time you dont' really need it I say.
However if you want to push it from time to time then it might be wise to get.
Also cooler fluid will be more viscous which will slightly raise line pressure which could provide faster and crisper shifts. Coolers will allow longer tranny life.
Was yoru car an auto when the swap was done? Do you still have the stock radiator if from a auto car? There is a cooler built into that. The lines run from the back of the car to the rad already. You would just have to run some lines to the factory fiero lines in the engine bay, and then they would take it to the rad.
Thats what brings tranny temps up pretty high. Normal driving won't overheat the fluid.
if you drive normal most of the time you dont' really need it I say.
However if you want to push it from time to time then it might be wise to get.
Also cooler fluid will be more viscous which will slightly raise line pressure which could provide faster and crisper shifts. Coolers will allow longer tranny life.
Was yoru car an auto when the swap was done? Do you still have the stock radiator if from a auto car? There is a cooler built into that. The lines run from the back of the car to the rad already. You would just have to run some lines to the factory fiero lines in the engine bay, and then they would take it to the rad.
Yes on all that. I know that AT radiators have a cooler built in, that's why I question if an additional cooler would be of any benefit. Thanks for the responses.Shaun41178(2) wrote: Was yoru car an auto when the swap was done? Do you still have the stock radiator if from a auto car? There is a cooler built into that. The lines run from the back of the car to the rad already. You would just have to run some lines to the factory fiero lines in the engine bay, and then they would take it to the rad.
Do it. The fluid really heats up when the TC is unlocked. I have a trans gauge and cooler on my truck and the temperature rise is huge when the TC unlocks (all that slip).
I'm running a second cooler on my Ciera GT and it dropped the temps 30F down into the 150F range which is very good for the trans. Max I've even seen is 170F.
I'm running a second cooler on my Ciera GT and it dropped the temps 30F down into the 150F range which is very good for the trans. Max I've even seen is 170F.
-
Shaun41178(2)
- Posts: 8368
- Joined: Fri Nov 19, 2004 7:12 pm
- Location: Ben Phelps is an alleged scammer
if his transmission is not overheating then it is not necessary to buy a cooler.
Geez people.
Thats like adding a second radiator to your car even though the one does just fine. It makes no sense.
Your tranny was designed to push a 3500 pound car around. Its now pushing something much lighter. You dont' need a extra cooler.
If you still want to add a cooler thats your perogative. Will you see a benefit? Maybe. I doubt it though. From what I have noticed you dont' abuse that car. YOu should be fine without an additional.
Geez people.
Thats like adding a second radiator to your car even though the one does just fine. It makes no sense.
Your tranny was designed to push a 3500 pound car around. Its now pushing something much lighter. You dont' need a extra cooler.
If you still want to add a cooler thats your perogative. Will you see a benefit? Maybe. I doubt it though. From what I have noticed you dont' abuse that car. YOu should be fine without an additional.
Define "abuse".Shaun41178(2) wrote: From what I have noticed you dont' abuse that car.
I did have my tranny drained and filled, including my torque converter, along with a new filter about 8000 miles ago. It seemed to help. Really, it seems to give me more problem after setting for a while then after regular use. However, after flogging it on Hwy 25 for an hour or so (high speed twisties) it is a bit more reluctant to shift.
So the consensus I'm getting is yes, it would help, but do I need the help bad enough to justify the expense and modifications to put in a secondary cooler. Probably not.
-
groovieguy
- Posts: 22
- Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 7:46 pm
- Location: Suncoast
I found this at GM Tuners website. I believe in Tranny coolers used them before on different highly modified cars. I also bewlieve if you are having those problems then you need to do something.
Why do you need an external transmission cooler? Many "performance" websites these days are telling everyone it is unnecessary to run an external transmission cooler. Their reasoning for this is the assumption that external coolers are a source for leaks. If installed incorrectly and with inferior hardware, this can be true. However, none of these websites bother to state the benefits of having a transmission fluid cooler on your vehicle.
Transmission builders and aftermarket part manufacturers have known for years the benefits of maintaining "lower" transmission fluid operating temps. Automatic trans fluid temps in most cars and trucks run between 195° F and 230° F. Most aftermarket builders agree that 170° F - 180° F is preferred for the best balance of durability, consistency, and performance. You also don't want your transmission fluid temps too cold because at those lower temps, problems with consistency and lubrication can result. Of course higher temps can cause fluid breakdown and eventually transmission failure.
When do you need an external transmission fluid cooler? Well we all know that if you are doing any towing you should have one. But if you have increased the performance of your engine or installed a higher stall torque converter, it would be a good idea to have a cooler. Even when using a stock torque converter, increased engine power output will cause the stock torque converter to stall higher which heats the fluid more than normal. Most aftermarket converters stall higher which in itself, causes higher fluid temperatures due to the increased fluid sheer forces and pressures in within the torque converter.
So how do you install one on your vehicle to insure against leaks? Very Simple. First, use only the correct size and type hose for the size fittings or lines you are working with. DO NOT USE FUEL HOSE. Transmission fluid specific hose is rated for the pressure and chemical properties of transmission fluid. I also recommend using high-quality clamps, the type that use a fine-threaded bolt and nut to tighten them with. You can use the cheap screw/slotted band type clamps in a pinch, but I recommend bending the excess band over the screw head once the clamp is tightened to prevent loosening. The cheaper type clamps are the cause of probably all of the leak problems pointed out by most websites. Also if you have to cut the OEM metal trans cooler lines in order to accommodate the trans cooler hose connections, it would be a wise practice to put a slight flare on the end of those metal lines so the hose cannot blow off of it when properly clamped. Most brake line flaring tools do the trick and are cheap and easy to find.
http://dtcc.cz28.com/tech.htm
Here is another link which shows what happens to the tranny after over heating. http://www.transmissioncenter.net/TransTemp.htm
Why do you need an external transmission cooler? Many "performance" websites these days are telling everyone it is unnecessary to run an external transmission cooler. Their reasoning for this is the assumption that external coolers are a source for leaks. If installed incorrectly and with inferior hardware, this can be true. However, none of these websites bother to state the benefits of having a transmission fluid cooler on your vehicle.
Transmission builders and aftermarket part manufacturers have known for years the benefits of maintaining "lower" transmission fluid operating temps. Automatic trans fluid temps in most cars and trucks run between 195° F and 230° F. Most aftermarket builders agree that 170° F - 180° F is preferred for the best balance of durability, consistency, and performance. You also don't want your transmission fluid temps too cold because at those lower temps, problems with consistency and lubrication can result. Of course higher temps can cause fluid breakdown and eventually transmission failure.
When do you need an external transmission fluid cooler? Well we all know that if you are doing any towing you should have one. But if you have increased the performance of your engine or installed a higher stall torque converter, it would be a good idea to have a cooler. Even when using a stock torque converter, increased engine power output will cause the stock torque converter to stall higher which heats the fluid more than normal. Most aftermarket converters stall higher which in itself, causes higher fluid temperatures due to the increased fluid sheer forces and pressures in within the torque converter.
So how do you install one on your vehicle to insure against leaks? Very Simple. First, use only the correct size and type hose for the size fittings or lines you are working with. DO NOT USE FUEL HOSE. Transmission fluid specific hose is rated for the pressure and chemical properties of transmission fluid. I also recommend using high-quality clamps, the type that use a fine-threaded bolt and nut to tighten them with. You can use the cheap screw/slotted band type clamps in a pinch, but I recommend bending the excess band over the screw head once the clamp is tightened to prevent loosening. The cheaper type clamps are the cause of probably all of the leak problems pointed out by most websites. Also if you have to cut the OEM metal trans cooler lines in order to accommodate the trans cooler hose connections, it would be a wise practice to put a slight flare on the end of those metal lines so the hose cannot blow off of it when properly clamped. Most brake line flaring tools do the trick and are cheap and easy to find.
http://dtcc.cz28.com/tech.htm
Here is another link which shows what happens to the tranny after over heating. http://www.transmissioncenter.net/TransTemp.htm