AWD V-8 GTR? Possibly Possible.

[crzyone]

If that oil pan could be adapted to an LS1, that would solve to my AWD Skyline LS1 problem

I would love to figure out how to make my car V-8 powered, while keeping it all wheel drive.

[crzyone]

And on that note- I have to say, the number of "fabricators" on the Fiero boards makes the RX7 and GTR boards look pathetic. I have found myself falling into the overpriced, buy it because I can trap with these cars. I have not had to build anything myself which was part of the fun with the Fiero.

So cudos to Fiero owners. If the part doesn't exist, make it. If Skylines were cheap and availabe, I'm sure some ex-fiero owner would have had an LSX in it long ago. So far, this is as far as anyone I've seen has gotten.

http://forums.gtrcanada.com/gt-r-projec ... oject.html

And the project died before it really got started.

[The Dark Side of Will]

The "Like the Retard on Viagra" picture has an LS1 Skyline... don't know if that's a GT-R or not...

You could build a V8 AWD Skyline using the VVT Northstar from an STS-4, but that would be heavier than an LS1. Easier to spin it fast and keep the Skyline's character, though.

You could go with a fully external diff like the Ford 8.8 from an Explorer, for example. You'll need a custom fabbed aluminum pan to package it in a tight engine bay, but that's just money. It probably won't ever be as integrated as the OE cast aluminum pan/diff combo, but that's the price you pay for hot rodding.

[Aaron]

Trailblazer SS?

[crzyone]

If I had it my way I would find a way to mount the rb26 oil pan/ front diff to an ls1. If I had some welding skills I imagine it wouldn't be too difficult. Might have to mount the ls1 a little higher to clear everything.

[The Dark Side of Will]

Trailblazer SS?

Good idea... I'd been thinking about the T-case from a Trailblazer SS or Silverado SS, but didn't think about the front axle part. I think the diff is mounted to the frame on the Silverado, but I don't know about the Trailblazer.

Here's a topic on the 4.2 I6 front diff: http://forums.trailvoy.com/showthread.php?t=70562

[fieroguru]

I think the diff is mounted to the frame on the Silverado, but I don't know about the Trailblazer.

The trailblazer SS front differential is bolted directly to the side of the oil pan with the axle going through the pan:

[The Dark Side of Will]

I think the diff is mounted to the frame on the Silverado, but I don't know about the Trailblazer.

The trailblazer SS front differential is bolted directly to the side of the oil pan with the axle going through the pan:
http://tomboynton.com/JuneWork4.jpg
http://www.ls1fc.com/images/dim_oil_pan ... 78x780.jpg

Cool. Thanks. I had plugged "Trailblazer SS front differential" into Google Images, but apparently didn't look long enough to find these.
Also considered it likely because the Trailblazer I6 front drive hardware is configured similarly.

There you go Levi! Get to work!

Here's the page the above picture is from, just for a couple more... http://tomboynton.com/Trailblazer.htm

[crzyone]

Now I have some stuff to think about..... Now all I need is a 4:11 front end for the trailblazer diff or match the GTR's rear... hmmmm

This is tough. I could probably build this swap for the cost of repairing my RB26

[The Dark Side of Will]

Did something happen to your RB?

[crzyone]

Yeah, one of the cam caps came off and did some damage while it was rattling around the head. There were another 2 bolts lose on other cam caps. The company that build my engine either didn't torque them proper or not at all... Should have used loctite.

So now I need to pull my head, replace a few cam caps and followers. Hopefully the head it's self is ok.

[The Dark Side of Will]

A couple of guys on Pfiffle have had problems with Northstar cam cap bolts coming loose. I suspect it was due to overtorque by the assembler (poster was not assembler in both cases).

www.mcmaster.com has some light weight torque wrenches that can be used to get the correct pull on small bolts like that.

[The Dark Side of Will]

Now I have some stuff to think about..... Now all I need is a 4:11 front end for the trailblazer diff or match the GTR's rear... hmmmm

This is tough. I could probably build this swap for the cost of repairing my RB26

The big "will it blend?" question is the whether you can get the axle centerline in roughly the same location as it is stock. In the case of my project, the E53 pan puts the axle pretty close to where the e30 pan puts it. The limitation for moving the engine forward is interference between the front wall of the sump and the crossmember. The limitation for moving it rearward is interference between the back ends of the cylinder heads (and their cam position sensor electrical connectors) and the firewall. From the measurements I've been able to find on the net, (and from looking at an M62 E30 swap) the total range for for/aft location of the engine is likely to be <1.5". That's pretty snug.

Found a couple of resources that say the TBSS already has 4.10 gears:
http://www.insideline.com/chevrolet/tra ... er-ss.html
http://www.trucktrend.com/roadtests/suv ... specs.html

[The Dark Side of Will]

AWD T56... Hmm....

http://www.syty.net/forums/showthread.php?t=66882

Also another view of the TBSS oil pan.



http://www.syty.net/forums/showthread.php?p=284271

http://home.comcast.net/~xr4x4ti/V8_AWD_Pictures.htm

******

http://www.s-seriesforum.com/forum/show ... d3&t=55582

http://www.tbssowners.com/forums/showth ... 87&t=27335

http://ls1tech.com/forums/manual-transm ... e-awd.html


Not sure how it would fit in the R32 body, but I will likely need to have a custom output shaft made to dramatically reduce the length of the drivetrain to fit it into the E30 body.

However, that's a long way down the road. I'm going to get it running with the ZF 5 speed first, THEN worry about things like this.

[crzyone]

Damn, looking at the pics it looks like I couldn't use the GTRs transfer case (the source of the magical awd).



The GTR has the front diff and transfer case on the opposite side of the trailblazers

Full lock AWD would cause understeer. Most true road acing GTRs have about 30% torque going to the front at all times. You can vary it with a TSC (torque split controller) on the R32 GTR. With the flip of a switch you can be just RWD as well.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/110738444569?ss ... 1423.l2649

[The Dark Side of Will]

Was wondering about that... I thought I'd seen an RB26 on ebay a while back with the diff on the right side.

If the transfer case doesn't care which way is up, there's nothing stopping you from clocking it around.

Putting the drop on the opposite side will also require floorpan/transmission tunnel surgery, but that won't be so hard since you've already ripped your interior out and installed a cage.

However the extra volume from clearance for the stock front drive hardware would give you a huge amount of space for packaging the exhaust.

[crzyone]

If the transfer case doesn't care which way is up, there's nothing stopping you from clocking it around.

I think I found a problem... doh!



Cutting the tunnel or the firewall to make everything fit wouldn't bother me since it is just an empty race car.

It looks like that front diff on the trailblazer isn't directly connected to the engine. I wonder if it could be mounted upside down on the other side of the engine somehow....

It would be pretty badass to be the first LSX GTR. There is literally no downside to an LSX over the RB26. A 500hp LS with lots of low and mid range torque coupled to the Skyline's AWD system would be awesome. Better weight distribution as well. If I had to make a custom driveshaft and propshaft, moving the engine furthur back into the firewall would be beneficial as well.

All this is theoretical though. I couldn't figure it out by myself. Adapting an LSX to the GTR trani or the GTR transfer case to the T56 is likely passed my skillz.

[crzyone]

I was thinking, someone must have already made an adapter for an LSX to RB, turns out there is a glimmer of hope. Have to do more searching to see where I can find it and if it will work on a GTR trani.

http://zilvia.net/f/tech-talk/175331-z3 ... ranny.html

http://forums.hybridz.org/index.php/top ... 300zx-box/

Adapter to put a GM auto on an RB26, not helping much
http://www.atiracing.com/products/adapterk/akit.htm

[The Dark Side of Will]

How bad do you want it? Are you willing to buy another RB oil pan, cut the diff out of it and weld it into an LS1 pan?

Are you willing to cut up the tunnel in your car to move the shifter? As shown above, the T56 can have the shifter mounted to the main case. Once adapted, the T-case shifter location could be blocked off.
With the right engineering, you *MIGHT* be able to run the T56 shift rod through to the Skyline T-case and keep the shifter where it is stock...

There appear to be ways to go forward...

Also, how does the Skyline T-case work? BMW's current X-drive hardware uses a T-case with a computer actuated clutch to control front driveshaft torque. Those are left drop...

IE, is there a planetary drive of some sort that splits the torque front-rear and allows differentiation?
Or does all the torque applied to the front driveshaft come through the clutch?

[crzyone]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ATTESA_E-TS

Yes, wet clutch variable torque to the front wheels.

If I did this, I would have to do it the simplist way possible. I would like it to be repeatable so that maybe a kit could be created. Adapting the GTR's front diff to the LS or moving the TB's to the opposite side while retaining the stock GTR transmission would probably be the best way. With an adapter plate and some sort of starter adapter would be easiest, a custom bellhousing would be best but more costly. There are stronger internal options already available for the GTR transmission if someone wanted to go beyond a stock LS1.

That 6L block with the 5.3 crank sounds like it would be the perfect engine for this swap. High rpm, high HP and lower torque to save the driveline.