Real Fiero Tech

Just thought these were kinda neat and worth sharing.
http://youtu.be/uJSLDq7MkhQ
http://youtu.be/c19kn3drdFU

There are a LOT of alternative engine designs out there. If one really were "better" than the traditional, it would be in use... such is the pressure that emissions and fuel economy regulations place on auto manufacturers.

MANY MANY alternative designs (e.g. rotary valves) are conceived with unrecoverable fatal flaws that relegate them to the engine test stands of history.

Most of these flaws have to do with sealing (e.g. rotary valves)... most of the rest have to do with basic material properties. For example, axial piston engines--and there have been many--frequently have contact stresses on the swash plate which are so high that no mass-producible material can last very long in service.

Airplane engines are a different market... BUT, mainstream piston engine MFG's know where their place in the market is. Alternative designers can't beat mainstream piston manufacturers at the mainstream piston game, so they are trying to beat turbines at the turbine game using pistons... and that's just not going to happen.

The Dark Side of Will wrote:There are a LOT of alternative engine designs out there. If one really were "better" than the traditional, it would be in use... such is the pressure that emissions and fuel economy regulations place on auto manufacturers.

MANY MANY alternative designs (e.g. rotary valves) are conceived with unrecoverable fatal flaws that relegate them to the engine test stands of history.

Most of these flaws have to do with sealing... most of the rest have to do with basic material properties. For example, axial piston engines--and there have been many--frequently have contact stresses on the swash plate which are so high that no mass-producible material can last very long in service.

Airplane engines are a different market... BUT, mainstream piston engine MFG's know where their place in the market is. Alternative designers can't beat mainstream piston manufacturers at the mainstream piston game, so they are trying to beat turbines at the turbine game using pistons... and that's just not going to happen.

I just thought it was cool. I agree that the material stresses would be insane. I always thought the rotary valves were cool, but wondered how you would make them seal.

here's another cool design.

http://www.kiss-engineering.com/Slide1.jpg

http://www.kiss-engineering.com/

http://www.google.com/patents/US20050076864

Out of the alternative engines I'm glad the Wankle made it to mass production.

crzyone wrote:Out of the alternative engines I'm glad the Wankle made it to mass production.

Those are some quirky little bastards. when they're good, they're awesome, when they're bad...

Took me a few minutes to find this. I remembered a show I watched a few years ago that showed a German WWII engine that had opposing cylinders.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Junkers_Jumo_205

I forgot it was a diesel. This is a pretty neat failed design. I imagine it would be much better suited in a power generating role.

ericjon262 wrote:

crzyone wrote:Out of the alternative engines I'm glad the Wankle made it to mass production.

Those are some quirky little bastards. when they're good, they're awesome, when they're bad...

Factory Mazda seals are fine for most stock setups, but as soon as you put that motor and a few turbos into a sports car guys are going to fuck with it. My engine now has Rotary Aviation apex seals which are damn near indestructible. My friend that rebuilds and races rotaries has yet to blow up an RA super seal motor. That includes 400whp endurance races lasting 8 hours.

crzyone wrote:Took me a few minutes to find this. I remembered a show I watched a few years ago that showed a German WWII engine that had opposing cylinders.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Junkers_Jumo_205

I forgot it was a diesel. This is a pretty neat failed design. I imagine it would be much better suited in a power generating role.

not really a failed design, Lookup "fairbanks-morse"

Lots of freight trains and tugboats use them.

ericjon262 wrote:

crzyone wrote:Took me a few minutes to find this. I remembered a show I watched a few years ago that showed a German WWII engine that had opposing cylinders.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Junkers_Jumo_205

I forgot it was a diesel. This is a pretty neat failed design. I imagine it would be much better suited in a power generating role.

not really a failed design, Lookup "fairbanks-morse"

Lots of freight trains and tugboats use them.

Also the Napier Deltic, which has 3 crankshafts geared to a common output. It's three of the Junkers engines arranged in a triangle.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napier_Deltic

The Dark Side of Will wrote:
Also the Napier Deltic, which has 3 crankshafts geared to a common output. It's three of the Junkers engines arranged in a triangle.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napier_Deltic

that's a new one for me, pretty cool.

ericjon262 wrote:

The Dark Side of Will wrote:There are a LOT of alternative engine designs out there. If one really were "better" than the traditional, it would be in use... such is the pressure that emissions and fuel economy regulations place on auto manufacturers.

MANY MANY alternative designs (e.g. rotary valves) are conceived with unrecoverable fatal flaws that relegate them to the engine test stands of history.

Most of these flaws have to do with sealing... most of the rest have to do with basic material properties. For example, axial piston engines--and there have been many--frequently have contact stresses on the swash plate which are so high that no mass-producible material can last very long in service.

Airplane engines are a different market... BUT, mainstream piston engine MFG's know where their place in the market is. Alternative designers can't beat mainstream piston manufacturers at the mainstream piston game, so they are trying to beat turbines at the turbine game using pistons... and that's just not going to happen.

I just thought it was cool. I agree that the material stresses would be insane. I always thought the rotary valves were cool, but wondered how you would make them seal.

here's another cool design.

http://www.kiss-engineering.com/Slide1.jpg

http://www.kiss-engineering.com/

http://www.google.com/patents/US20050076864

Another one in which the contact stresses are likely unworkable.

I'd still like to see one in operation. they had a video up somewhere, it looked like it shook around really bad...