Real Fiero Tech

I decided to break this out of the billet block thread, you can see the original here:

http://realfierotech.com/phpBB/viewtopi ... =9&t=18065


the heads!





CNC intake ports





CNC exhaust ports.





the heads don't have any large oil drains to allow oil to drain back to the valley. there are two small drains, both with restrictions installed to limit flow. one is in the first cylinders exhaust valve spring pocket, the other in the last. you can also see the marks left by the rocker stands. these engines use shaft mount rocker arms, which are bolted to stands that are bolted to the heads. from what I have seen there are at least 2 types of stand, a multi-piece, and a single piece, from what I can see, it appears this set used the single piece design.





interesting notes here, each head has 3 dowel pin locations, one in the middle outboard head bolt, and on in each corner inboard head bolt. the middle pin location is slotted vertically, and outer two are slotted horizontally, maintaining the head in position but still allowing for thermal expansion.







coolant enters the head through one large passage on the outside of the "V" and 6 smaller holes. coolant exits under each intake port to the radiator in a water manifold. coolant inlet is at about 7 o'clock, the outlet is at about 1 o'clock. note, in the picture you can see all three head dowels.



The heads use 6 bolts per cylinder to attach the head to the block. if you look here, on the left, there is a threaded hole, that is the 6th bolt hole, it threads into the head from the lifter valley instead of from the top and into the block.





the small hole in the front corner of the head is a oil passage. the valve covers have an integrated spring oiler passage to keep the springs cool at 10,000 RPM.



The valves are Ti, and at slightly different angles. the intake valves use 6MM stems and are ~2.20" diameter, and the exhaust uses 7MM stems and are ~1.60". another interesting note, the edge of the intake valves is below the deck surface, take care when handling heads with valves installed to not let the deck slide on anything.







I will update this as I acquire parts, and as I begin the build.

So what about this makes you a "retard"...? What's this all going into?

I still haven't made a hard decision on what this is going into.

I've got 2 ideas.

Pro touring style 3rd gen firebird, something like this:



or:

Custom, one off track toy inspired by 1960's F1 car designs, like this:



Pro touring 'bird is definitely easier than the F1 car, but the F1 car would be much more fun and a bit more challenging. I also want 2 seats, so keeping the F1 look gets more complicated.

I'm still very deep in the parts acquisition phase, so I still have plenty of time to figure it out as well.

why is it full retard? 800+ hp N/A out of 358 cubes, I think that meets the prerequisites for full retard.

got some rockers and an intake in today. The rockers are T&D Shaft mount rockers. 2.20 ratio. each rocker has a PN and Date on them, the newest rockers are under 1 year old, the oldest are about 6 years old, average age is about 2 years.









The intake was a slight disappointment, but not completely unexpected. the ports on the intake are short and fat, the ports on the heads are tall and less fat. although the port mismatch could be corrected, I think I'm going to pass on this intake, maybe re-list it and see if I get lucky.

Is there any reasonable way to make one of those heads work on any SD4 block?

I was perusing ebay, the parts don't seem all that expensive, but why can't I find an R07 blocks? I thought the block was specific as well.

Fwiw, isn't "full retard" a movie quote from some crappy comedy movie.

Series8217 wrote:Is there any reasonable way to make one of those heads work on any SD4 block?

that would be awesome, but not unless a SD4 is on 4.5" bore centers. Midget 4 cylinder engine exists, but use a different head, it's on the same bore center, but positions the pushrods on the exhaust side.

http://www.maxchevy.com/tech/2008/iii_5-midget-2.html

CincinnatiFiero wrote:I was perusing ebay, the parts don't seem all that expensive, but why can't I find an R07 blocks? I thought the block was specific as well.

The block is specific, and they are hard to find, which is why prices are so low, the market is very limited. I've been putting some feelers out there to try and find a block, we'll see what happens., I would imagine they will become more available in the next few years, much like the SB2/SB2.2 has.

CincinnatiFiero wrote: Fwiw, isn't "full retard" a movie quote from some crappy comedy movie.

It's a phrase I've used for several years b/c I'm classy like that. it may have been used in a movie as well, IDK, I don't watch movies very often.

Series8217 wrote:Is there any reasonable way to make one of those heads work on any SD4 block?

KRP will sell an SD4 block that will accept an SB2.2 head.

I @$$ume that Arias' aluminum SD4 block can be ordered to accept a SB2.2 head as well.

here's a quick read on the r07 for interested parties.

http://www.hotrod.com/how-to/engine/hrd ... ar-engine/

the water manifold provides a seal for the top of the lifter valley, and allows the intake manifold to be completely "dry", no coolant flows in the intake manifold, nor does hot oil contact the underside like on a traditional SBC.

here, you can see the manifold draws coolant from each individual cylinder, helping to maintain even temperatures across the entire engine. a sharp eye will notice the main coolant channel gets progressively wider as you approach the outlet, helping to maintain equal coolant flow from each cylinder.



you can see on the underside, as well as getting wider, the main passage also gets deeper.



here you can see that each coolant port has it's own individual O-ring seal, and the block/head surface has it's own as well to seal the lifter valley. this would require both seals to fail in close proximity to introduce coolant into the oil.

I spy... tactical blueberries.

Trivia: NASCAR pre-pressurizes their cooling systems to something like 30 psi cold in order to avoid cavitation in the waterpump and boiling in the heads.

The Dark Side of Will wrote:I spy... tactical blueberries.

oh geez...

The Dark Side of Will wrote: Trivia: NASCAR pre-pressurizes their cooling systems to something like 30 psi cold in order to avoid cavitation in the waterpump and boiling in the heads.

that's a new one for me, pretty intense too. but when you think about the power output, RPM, and duration of high power operation, it makes enough sense.

a bit of new info:

Valvetrain parts are mostly custom. the heads come with the valve guides installed, and then the builder carves the ports out from there, so valve positions are set by GM. Rocker position however, is not, it's set by each individual builder. I haven't seen anything but shaft mount rockers on the R07 engines, which as you know, require a support stand to hold the rocker up, the individual builders make these stands, all of them that I have seen are machined steel. the builder also drills and taps the head casting to mount the stands.

I have seen two types of stand, individual, and what I am calling integrated. the individual type uses one stand for each rocker, the integrated, uses one large stand to support all the rockers on one head. similar to how the Cadillac 4.9 rockers are installed.







the unfortunate part, is that because each shop builds them different, none are interchangeable, and because a steel bridge doesn't really wear out, they stay with the builders and get re-used on other engines instead of sold with the heads. the set pictured is for an ECR engine, so to use them, I'll have to get a set of ECR heads. This is the second set of rocker stands I've seen available, and I've been looking at R07 parts for a couple of years now, so I don't feel like this purchase was a loss.

it's harder than you might expect to find a set of R07 valve covers that don't say "Chevrolet" in big letters on them. I wanted plain, because this is not likely to be going in a Chevy.



The posts sticking down off the cover are valve spring sprayers to keep the springs cool at high RPM.





billet spacer

The timing set:

Belt drive is more efficient, and transmits less crankshaft harmonics to the valvetrain.



the crank pulley is one piece. the cam pulley is a two piece setup, and is infinitely adjustable in a small band.







the camshaft itself, bolts to a thrust bearing, which bolt to the front of the block, it has a a seal to keep oil from the cam bearings from wetting the belt. This one uses ball bearings, I plan on replacing it with a brand new unit prior to installing the engine when complete. The thrust bearing has a key installed, which aligns with a keyway on the spider of the upper cam pulley, one bolt secures the pulley to the cam/thrust bearing.





Front crank seal carrier. this prevents oil from the front main bearing or the oil pan from getting on the belt drive the flat side goes against the block.







The timing cover is carbon fiber, bolts to the front plate, and has holes for ventilation. this one has a couple of chips around the mounting holes, I might try to get a new one, but it's not high on the priority list, as it has no effect on function.

ericjon262 wrote:
The timing cover is carbon fiber, bolts to the front plate, and has holes for ventilation. this one has a couple of chips around the mounting holes, I might try to get a new one, but it's not high on the priority list, as it has no effect on function.

Yeah, looks fine, but it is a good example of the "Carbon EVERYTHING!" mindset. Most cross-ply or woven laminates like that need an E/D ratio of at least 3 or 4. One of the unfortunate difficulties of composites.

well gents, I'm on a list for an engine block. I've been keeping my eyes out for a specific set of heads too. might sell the sets I currently have to fund a newer set of Hendrick pieces. I currently have a set of x017's, and x024's. I would like to get a set of x029's, they're the latest, most current heads, but they're also the hardest to find.

Whatever this engine goes into is going to be a beast.

crzyone wrote:Whatever this engine goes into is going to be a beast.

No joke. This is making me want to sell my SD stuff and start one of these up!