Lucky's full of crap

lucky · Post by **lucky** » Sun Jun 03, 2007 1:31 pm

After my comments in Starlite's thread on cruise control cable slack you're all thinkin it. So bring it on.

Starlite528 · Post by **Starlite528** » Sun Jun 03, 2007 1:57 pm

lucky80 wrote:After my comments in Starlight's thread on cruise control cable slack you're all thinkin it. So bring it on.

I don't know if you're full of crap or not, doesn't sound like it. But do get my name rite, it's 'lite' with an 'I T E'

:fart: :thumbleft:

lucky · Post by **lucky** » Sun Jun 03, 2007 3:08 pm

sorry, was typing fast and not fully paying attention

p8ntman442 · Post by **p8ntman442** » Sun Jun 03, 2007 5:15 pm

ok, just fill your tank, then reset the trip meter. Drive 100 miles or so and fill up again. Post the miles on the trip meter, and the gas reciept. We will do the math.

Tire size, and transmission gear ratio are also going to be needed.

WE call bullshit, you prove us wrong. Thats the difference between RFT and Old Europe.

lucky · Post by **lucky** » Sun Jun 03, 2007 5:40 pm

my tripmeter rolls backwards, so no help there, and i've passed advanced calculus with flying colors so i think i can do the math.
as far as gear ratio, I have no clue what the three other people (that I know of) who owned the car before me did. The last was an ASE certified master machinist with 25 years engine and transmission rebuilding experience, who told me basically what he did when he rebuilt this formerly junkyard 2.8 because the engine he got with the car had the #3 and #6 connecting rods blown off the crank and through the side of the block. he gave me that motor for parts, man it was bad.

I will take a photo of my odometer the next time i fill my tank and take a trip on the highway just to document "actual" mileage. I will post photo's of mileage after and gas receipt as well.

Starlite528 · Post by **Starlite528** » Sun Jun 03, 2007 6:29 pm

I know you can get a laptop and a GPS unit, or just a gps unit by itself, but I don't know if any of the software you can get will help you calculate gas mileage. It would sure be easier to do it that way.

lucky · Post by **lucky** » Sun Jun 03, 2007 7:07 pm

fiero store sells a gm obdI to laptop interface with software, dunno if it does mileage tho.

p8ntman442 · Post by **p8ntman442** » Sun Jun 03, 2007 10:53 pm

yeah, ive passed calc 3 and diff eq's too, but thats not gonna make my 2.hate get more than 22 around town.

The Dark Side of Will · Mon Jun 04, 2007 8:54 am

I've seen almost 30 out of a 2.8/282 combo, but that was tooling around at 55 for the majority of a tank.

The highest I've seen at reasonable speeds like 75 is 27-27.5.

Since filling up isn't an exact science, you have to average mileage over multiple tanks of similar driving.

If you've passed calc, this shouldn't be hard.

Keep a log that looks like this:

Code: Select all

Primary
odometer    Fuel
reading     Amount   Cost
123456      10.956   $32.00
123656       8.654   $26.00
123856       8.798   $27.00
...          ...     ...

Gas mileage will then be self-evident.

Mach10 · Post by **Mach10** » Mon Jun 04, 2007 9:46 am

Or if you're truly hard-core, punch a hole in the bottom of your tank and install a pedcock. Drain the mofo DRY, and fill until the gas pump goes "click"

Drive the car until it starts bucking, drain off the tank, measure what's left, subtract off your gas receipt and compare to mileage gotten.

But that's if you're hard-core.

And if the argument means enough to you to mutilate your fuel system and potentially cause a fire and loss of human life.

cactus bastard · Post by **cactus bastard** » Mon Jun 04, 2007 10:04 am

You've got that backwards. The pump doesn't always click off at the same point, that's where the innacuracy comes from. Although.. I'm sure your actual mileage will vary by more than the factor of error anyways. Either way, the more data points, the better.

Wonderfalls · Post by **Wonderfalls** » Tue Jun 05, 2007 1:24 am

Mach10 wrote:Or if you're truly hard-core, punch a hole in the bottom of your tank and install a pedcock. Drain the mofo DRY, and fill until the gas pump goes "click"

Drive the car until it starts bucking, drain off the tank, measure what's left, subtract off your gas receipt and compare to mileage gotten.

But that's if you're hard-core.

And if the argument means enough to you to mutilate your fuel system and potentially cause a fire and loss of human life.

And use a GPS to measure miles so it's more accurate

Mach10 · Post by **Mach10** » Tue Jun 05, 2007 10:20 am

cactus bastard wrote:You've got that backwards. The pump doesn't always click off at the same point, that's where the innacuracy comes from. Although.. I'm sure your actual mileage will vary by more than the factor of error anyways. Either way, the more data points, the better.

Not at all; my method measures the gas actually USED. Filling until "click" just means that you're putting as much fuel as you can in the tank without (in theory) over-filling and soaking down your vapor canister (which skews your mileage--or so I hear).

Larger sample = more accurate average.

lucky · Post by **lucky** » Tue Jun 05, 2007 5:40 pm

since I started this controversial conversation i've been watching my gas guage like a hawk; I noticed today that it moves a lot faster between 1/2 and E than it does between F and 1/2. I'm changin the oil tonight, and probably the cold start injector too, cause i've been having some start then die issues after it sits for 6 or 8 hours. Saturday after I get outta work I'm gonna fill it then take a 2 hour loop around the local highways (195e 495n 95s 195e) and fill it again at the same station, same pump if possible. Afterwards I'll post starting mileage ending mileage and gas used to see if i'm full of crap or not.

I am gonna still assume my odometer is reasonably accurate based on those recent trips to NH in my GT then in my dad's f150. Sorry no GPS available.

befarrer · Post by **befarrer** » Wed Jun 06, 2007 3:08 pm

That is a good way to do it. That is how I measure mileage. My odometer is 99% accurate or greater. There are signs on the highway south of edmonton 1 KM apart for 6KM for odometer accuracy checks, and after 6KM, it reads excatly 6KM. My fuel gauge might read low, I fill up untill it clicks off, and after like 10KM of highway driving, my fuel gauge has already come off of full. When I fill at 1/4 of a tank or just under, I fit in 25L.

cactus bastard · Post by **cactus bastard** » Wed Jun 06, 2007 5:33 pm

Mach10 wrote: Not at all; my method measures the gas actually USED. Filling until "click" just means that you're putting as much fuel as you can in the tank without (in theory) over-filling and soaking down your vapor canister (which skews your mileage--or so I hear).

Larger sample = more accurate average.

Right, you're using that click just to get the larger sample, I thought you were using it as a measuring point, sorry.

lucky · Post by **lucky** » Mon Jun 11, 2007 9:47 pm

poured here on saturday, and now i'm having more stalling issues during cold starts..... gotta test my injectors. haven't forgotten about this. I'm gonna pull my intake apart tomorrow night try some other injectors i have.
if all goes well i'll take er for a long rip on the highway this weekend.

lucky · Post by **lucky** » Sat Jun 30, 2007 12:02 am

well, i don't have definitive #'s yet, but i've been keeping receipts with milage written down at fill-ups, and it appears i'm wrong.
currently, my mpg is about 32 highway and about 27 city.
i've been doin a lot of talkin with techs and thinking about what i've been doing with the car and atmospheric conditions as well..

i'm not saying i can guarantee that i was making the mileage i claimed
when i made those last few long highway trips, but my estimate makes sense thinking about it, but i found a flaw in my assumption.

one of our instore propagandas that played ad naseum all spring was about filling your tank during the coolest time of the day to maximize your fuel dollars. gas wants to evaporate easily at temperature so on the flip side the colder it is, the denser it it.

i've been running lean according to the ez scan 6000 i borrowed, 2 months ago when it was in the 50's around here the gas would've been denser in the tank at full than it is now at 90deg so it would've produced more particles once warmed to temp and burned.
my stalling problems haven't been as bad lately, which points to my EGR expirement being not a complete success, too much EGR flow it seems.
it helps with more complete combustion, but the egr flow is too much for the engine at low temp at idle, which has caused my driveability and stalling issue until the engine warms up. effect was worse at colder temps.

i've been paying attention also to the accuracy of my gas guage. filling as close to empty as possible and paying in advance to get close to a number that will be close to an easily recognizeable value.
i.e. filling at E approximately 3.3 gallons and watching how close the guage went to a 1/3 of a tank.
it appears to be reasonably accurate, and my gas cap and carbon canister filter are new, so evap conditions are as optimal as possible.
i'm sure over the winter i was putting in 11 gallons to fill the tank, now only 9 or so. the tendancy of the fuel to evaporate would cause the pump to click off faster at warm temps, than it would at cold temps when the gas evaporates less easily. so assuming a 10 gallon capacity sewed my math as i actually had quite a bit more denser fuel burning more completely with a colder air charge, especially in NH where it was in the 30's for many miles of my trips. Now with the 90 deg temps here in New England, my milage by the same assumptions is bad with the 9 gallons or so it takes to fill the tank, and the hot humid air charge the same approximate math of ten gallon tank gives me an approximate mileage of 25 in the city, when in actuality at 9 gallons its closer to 27 mpg at 250 miles combination city highway on a full tank.
i'll post current actual milage and gallon #'s soon.

Real Fiero Tech

Lucky's full of crap

Lucky's full of crap

Re: Lucky's full of crap