LS4 / 4T65-E spy pics

Sinister Fiero · Post by **Sinister Fiero** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 11:14 pm

All parts courtesy of Ed Morad Parts Company

What do you suppose I will be putting this into?

-ryan

crzyone · Post by **crzyone** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 11:32 pm

A Fiero?

befarrer · Post by **befarrer** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 12:10 am

a Chevy sprint?

Ford Tarus?

Honda?

Aaron · Post by **Aaron** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 12:47 am

That just looks like hell on Earth :salute:

I'm sure once you clean it up, and dig into it though, it's the same as any other engine swap. Just lighter, stronger, and about double the wiring...haha

Have fun, and please, tons of pictures!

Shaun41178(2) · Post by **Shaun41178(2)** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 12:47 am

Festiva?

Fastback86 · Post by **Fastback86** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 3:07 am

Come on, Pinto!

Indy · Post by **Indy** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 1:10 pm

The answer is obvious...
Volkswagen New Bug.

What's up with the last pic? Is that the drive-by-wire gas pedal?

AkursedX · Post by **AkursedX** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 9:15 pm

I saw this engine/trans combo today in person and it is HUGE!! It looks the same size as the northstar/auto swaps and I still can't figure out how those fit into a Fiero. That's going to be a very interesting swap.

Sinister Fiero · Post by **Sinister Fiero** » Fri Jul 27, 2007 2:11 am

Indy wrote: What's up with the last pic? Is that the drive-by-wire gas pedal?

Yes, last pic shows the gas pedal position sensor (assy). Also in that pic are the compass and antenna modules.

Emc209i · Post by **Emc209i** » Fri Jul 27, 2007 11:27 am

Put it in a Fiero. I'd like to see someone who knows what they are doing build more V8's.

Sinister Fiero · Post by **Sinister Fiero** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 5:27 pm

Emc209i wrote:Put it in a Fiero.

That's where it is going. Don't worry, I will take lots of pics.

-ryan

crzyone · Post by **crzyone** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 7:00 pm

crzyone wrote:A Fiero?

I win!

whipped · Post by **whipped** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 9:11 pm

okaaay... :salute:

p8ntman442 · Post by **p8ntman442** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 9:18 pm

edit..... thank you.

Sinister Fiero · Post by **Sinister Fiero** » Tue Jul 31, 2007 5:09 pm

p8ntman442 wrote:
Lets not get this thread all tied up with a pissing match. Its obvious that Ryan would not do that to his setup.

Thanks, that's just what I was going to say. I am currently pondering many different ways we can go with the exhaust system; I didn't get the impression from my customer that he wanted his trunk cut. So I need to find out for sure from him how quiet he needs it and if he will ever need to submit this vehicle to emissions tests.

I would like to use the stock manifolds that came on the LS4 if I can; but I need to pull them off the engine and see how good (or bad) the casting is inside the ports. The customer has expressed interest in having me port the cyl heads on this engine so if I do that, I will need to make sure the exhaust matches up. I do have access to a TIG welder and a local company that makes custom header kit parts (flanges, primary pipes, etc) so that is always another option should the customer want to pay for it.

Sinister Fiero · Post by **Sinister Fiero** » Sun Aug 05, 2007 6:15 pm

Some observations and info...

The water pump housing is actually quite large and bolts to the front of the block and one cylinder head. It is seperate from the timing chain cover. It has a coolant fill point with hose connections for the overflow tank and radiator air bleed built right in. The radiator cap also screws into this cover. GM p/n: 12569247 for those of you wishing to price it out.

The transmission to block bracket is cast aluminum. GM p/n 10306031.

The flexplate and crank mounting for the flexplate is most interesting. It looks like the standard late SBC mounting bolt pattern and hub size. There is a steel bushing pressed into the crank so it will work with the smaller, FWD torque converter. GM p/n for the flexplate is 12568922.

The starter has a 2nd mesh gear; both it and the primary drive gear and moved into position while starting via the solenoid. GM p/n on the starter is 12582471.

The alternator is a Denso unit and is rated at 135 amps. GM p/n 15139480.

Sinister Fiero · Post by **Sinister Fiero** » Sun Aug 05, 2007 6:29 pm

Took a lot more pictures and also put some information up about the LS4 on this new page:

http://www.gmtuners.com/LS4/index.htm

BigRedDeckSpoiler · Post by **BigRedDeckSpoiler** » Sun Aug 05, 2007 7:23 pm

Very cool!
Have you already found a way to make the PCM play nicely without the rest of the modules that it's looking for?
Or are you going for an aftermarket PCM?
Or is that all still to be determined?

Does the tranny use the standard PRND321 pattern, in addition to the tap shift?

The only other LS4 swap I've seen is (IIRC) being converted to a manual tranny and a carb.
Not to bag on that (god knows that *I* certainly couldn't do it) but it seems like a shame to waste all of that expensive technology.

Sinister Fiero · Post by **Sinister Fiero** » Mon Aug 13, 2007 1:45 pm

BigRedDeckSpoiler wrote:Very cool!
Have you already found a way to make the PCM play nicely without the rest of the modules that it's looking for?
Or are you going for an aftermarket PCM?
Or is that all still to be determined?

Does the tranny use the standard PRND321 pattern, in addition to the tap shift?

The only other LS4 swap I've seen is (IIRC) being converted to a manual tranny and a carb.
Not to bag on that (god knows that *I* certainly couldn't do it) but it seems like a shame to waste all of that expensive technology.

Sorry I haven't responded to this post in a while -- I changed the email address on my account here on RFT and my account got deactivated; didn't get reactivated until a day or two ago. Anyway, in response to your questions...

On the 2005 Grand Prix GXP, there are 3 major computer systems. The ECM, TCM, and BCM. According to the GM Service Manual, the BCM in this car is the primary wake-up module; or the computer that tells the other computers to power up when the key is turned on. Although it is unclear if it is really needed for the ECM to power up since the ECM sees all the same key-on, ignition power signals the BCM sees.

Anyway, I do plan on using the factory ECM and TCM in this swap. HP Tuners and EFI Live currently has programming software/hardware support for these computers (but not for the BCM). The BCM is being installed so we can see about hooking up the GXP's keyless entry, remote start, and DIC systems. I should be able to disable trouble codes in the ECM for the missing systems (ABS, trac control, etc); but there is nothing I can do with the BCM so I will work with that system when I get that far. My plan is to get the base swap done and then worry about the secondary systems later.

The TAPShift transmissions have the shift quadrant set up in this way: P-R-N-D-M.

Concerning other LS4 and LSx swaps, I have seen those but I have yet to see anyone do a fully-functional DoD V8 LS4 swap. And that's the purpose of this project. What would be better than having a 300+ HP V8 in a Fiero? =One that gets better than 30mpg HWY fuel economy! Don't you think?

BigRedDeckSpoiler · Post by **BigRedDeckSpoiler** » Mon Aug 13, 2007 6:38 pm

Sinister Fiero wrote:...What would be better than having a 300+ HP V8 in a Fiero? =One that gets better than 30mpg HWY fuel economy! Don't you think?

Hey... You're preaching to the choir.
I do electronics for a living, so I can appreciate the technological benefits of a well designed... anything.
Unfortunately I don't know much of anything about automotive electronics past 2001. (Since that's my newest vehicle.)
You certainly don't have to sell me on the technology, though.