Who wants to design a LZ itb intake and 3d print it?

[CaptainHindsight]

Since I'm designing it I can make the runners anyway that works. When I said slice before I meant the design not the actual old manifold.

[Series8217]

Since I'm designing it I can make the runners anyway that works. When I said slice before I meant the design not the actual old manifold.

You getting back into Fieros?

[CaptainHindsight]

Back into automotive engineering, design and fabrication in general.

[ericjon262]

man-00.jpg

Slicing the top off the current manifold and adding the ITB's might look like this installed. Only more pretty.

A guy named Marc a long time ago built a custom set but for an lx9/ 3400 lower intake manifold He did lz9 swaps in mgbs and what not. Had health issues, disappeared.

Instead of posting pics, I'll just post the link
https://www.60degreev6.com/vb5/forum/no ... p-for-sale

Not a real fan of this setup as it still uses the long factory runners on the lower intake. My itb intake had maybe 5-6 inch runners total and larger ports than a factory lower intake. I'd prefer it to look like my old itb, vs just bolting butterfly's onto the factory lower LZ intake

One of the previous owners of that setup had a faster 1/4 mile time with a ported stock plenum.

[ericjon262]

I got this far with an LX9, note the valve cover boxes are totally wrong, they need to be more or less parallel to the base flange, in this they were angled down towards the middle of the intake, which doesn't leave room for the rockers. there are a ton of design restrictions with a 3900 intake that don't seem apparent until you try and build one and realize nothing fits as easily as it should, I've posted pictures of head cross sections in the "splayed valve head porting" thread that could be useful for developing a proper intake, but it's also worth mentioning that the stock design isn't trash.

[The Dark Side of Will]

there are a ton of design restrictions with a 3900 intake that don't seem apparent until you try and build one and realize nothing fits as easily as it should,

Yeah, even Ferrari had to go from a 60 to a 65 degree bank angle on their V12's because packaging a fully developed intake tract in a 60 degree valley is legitimately difficult.

[ericjon262]

there are a ton of design restrictions with a 3900 intake that don't seem apparent until you try and build one and realize nothing fits as easily as it should,

Yeah, even Ferrari had to go from a 60 to a 65 degree bank angle on their V12's because packaging a fully developed intake tract in a 60 degree valley is legitimately difficult.

it either gets way too tall, or just plain awkward by covering the entire engine and becoming a maintenance nightmare.

[CaptainHindsight]

even Ferrari had to go from a 60 to a 65 degree bank angle on their V12's because packaging a fully developed intake tract in a 60 degree valley is legitimately difficult.

In all humility I have never worked for Ferrari

[CaptainHindsight]

I'm thinking about resin printing these with a printer similar to what I posted a pic of earlier. 100C isn't a problem.

[Shaun41178(2)]

I'm thinking about resin printing these with a printer similar to what I posted a pic of earlier. 100C isn't a problem.

What's your design looking like so far?

[The Dark Side of Will]

I got this far with an LX9, note the valve cover boxes are totally wrong, they need to be more or less parallel to the base flange, in this they were angled down towards the middle of the intake, which doesn't leave room for the rockers. there are a ton of design restrictions with a 3900 intake that don't seem apparent until you try and build one and realize nothing fits as easily as it should, I've posted pictures of head cross sections in the "splayed valve head porting" thread that could be useful for developing a proper intake, but it's also worth mentioning that the stock design isn't trash.

even Ferrari had to go from a 60 to a 65 degree bank angle on their V12's because packaging a fully developed intake tract in a 60 degree valley is legitimately difficult.

In all humility I have never worked for Ferrari

Neither have I, I just read about the change for, I think, the Enzo.

Ferrari V12's have ports centered on the bore centerline and a bank offset that's only the width of the connecting rod... thus the ports interfere with each other.
The V6/60 has a port offset to the bore centerline (I hope the same direction for each cylinder on the LZ9, but earlier engines did not), with a bank offset that is the width of the conrod PLUS the width of the "split" in the crank throw...

So you shouldn't have any trouble at all getting runners to fit.

[SappySE107]

I'm thinking about resin printing these with a printer similar to what I posted a pic of earlier. 100C isn't a problem.

is 100c enough? I print at 275c on a 110c bed for polycarbonate with an FDM printer.

[CaptainHindsight]

@ SappySE107 The 100C I referred to is the operating temp of the intake manifold.

The additive process is mSLA where monomers and oligomers + fillers are polymerized via a photoinitiator + UV into a solid. It's not the same process that you are used to, FDM/FFF (aka CNC glue gun) where a polymer filament is melted inside an extruder nozzle and deposited layer by layer onto itself to form the object.

[SappySE107]

I hadn't thought about it as a process that isn't melting at a higher temp to bond but I don't know what the difference in temp needed to make the bond is, or how that relates to how effective it is at holding its structure at that temp. So the resin printer stuff is expressed as its final max temp before it has deformation?

I've been mostly concerned with exhaust proximity to the printed parts, sitting at an idle. 100c might work, but id like to see 150c+ eventually, for something that can be ran long term. Otherwise its good for making molds at least.

[The Dark Side of Will]

Any material in the engine bay needs to be rated to at least 125C, and higher if it's close to the exhaust.

[Series8217]

Yep, I regularly run my coolant temp up around 240F / 115C. Are there resins that can hold up to that and full atmospheric pressure / vacuum? I know some people have successfully used FDM intake manifolds printed with PA-CF, which when printed and annealed properly can have an HDT above 175C at over 4 bar.

[SappySE107]

I had no idea annealing was a thing with plastics, but it would have to be outsourced most likely. Arduino oven setup? Its similar to the cryo process.

I can't design anything in CAD, but I can flowtest and test on an engine dyno if something gets designed and made. My printer is 6x6x7 so just runners for flow testing is probably all I could print.

[Series8217]

Polymaker PA-CF is supposed to be annealed at 80C for 6 hours. I do it with a big food dehydrator.

[CaptainHindsight]

I need to connect with a foundry near me that can handle aluminum and steels.
Our aluminum crucible only holds about 10 lbs up in Milwaukee.
I can print the sand molds. I just need a place that can pour.

The printer resins are like thermosets vs thermoplastics. Once cured they only soften slightly at high temps and then burn when hot enough. They don't go back to liquid after polymerization.

[CaptainHindsight]

https://docsend.com/view/xbqe7za6vx5dpk9q#
https://docs.polyspectra.com/material-p ... cor-alpha/

https://www.amazon.com/SuperHDT-Printer ... B0CH66L98R

https://www.amazon.com/Siraya-Tech-Scul ... 2147?psc=1

https://www.esun3d.com/uploads/H100-Hig ... S_V5.0.pdf