IDing a fastback/GT

nfswift · Post by **nfswift** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 2:01 pm

I've been informed that all fastback Fieros are GTs (is this true?) and this brings up the questions I have now.

Since I'm checking out a black 5-speed with an engine swap today I need to know a few things.

Details about the car are there are no details, the owner was vauge, it is a 1986, possibly with a quad 4 swap. I don't know which trans it is, just that it's a 5 speed.

The trick is the car has an entire fastback rear but an 84-85 non-aero nose.

What are some ways to tell if it's actually a fastback/GT??? Any ways to ID the transmission?

And last question from a noob, where is the VIN located on a Fiero so I can run it...

Any help's appreciated. It's a beast, but it just might be MY beast if it's good enough!

Boscolingus · Post by **Boscolingus** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 2:12 pm

The VIN is located on the dash, driverside, just under the windshield - visible from out side. Regardless if it was or wasn't a GT to begin with, it is now and thats all that really matters. All the VIN is really gonna tell you is if it was originally a 4 or 6 cylinder, either way it doesnt matter as it has an engine conversion.

If it is a 5 speed, it is going to be either an Isuzu or Getrag. The Isuzu is barely a step up from the 84 4 speed non-web casting transmission, then the Getrag with is tiny carrier bearings, then the Muncie 4-speed would be at the top of my list - A Muncie equiped with the 3:32 final drive from the high-mileage 84 case would win hands-down over anybody's worshiped 5 speed Getrag anyday

- but then again, thats just my opinion - and lets face it, opinions are like used car salesman, everybody dispises them :la:

derangedsheep · Post by **derangedsheep** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 2:13 pm

All fastbacks from the factory were GTs. The VIN is located directly in front of the drivers side dash speaker (you will have to read it from outside the car through the windshield though). If it is a GT it should begin 1G2PG97. The G97 designates it as a GT (G) and a fastback (97).

As far as the trans identification. I am not 100% sure but I believe that as far as 5 speeds go, if the shift cables run side-by-side it is a Getrag and if they run one on top of the other it is an Isuzu.

EDIT: The VIN sequence I mentioned is for an 86. If it is an 87 or an 88 it will go 1G2PG1197.

Boscolingus · Post by **Boscolingus** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 2:15 pm

yup - both cables on top = Isuzu
1 coming up from underneath = Getrag

nfswift · Post by **nfswift** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 2:17 pm

Boscolingus wrote:The VIN is located on the dash, driverside, just under the windshield - visible from out side. Regardless if it was or wasn't a GT to begin with, it is now and thats all that really matters. All the VIN is really gonna tell you is if it was originally a 4 or 6 cylinder, either way it doesnt matter as it has an engine conversion.

If it is a 5 speed, it is going to be either an Isuzu or Getrag. The Isuzu is barely a step up from the 84 4 speed non-web casting transmission, then the Getrag with is tiny carrier bearings, then the Muncie 4-speed would be at the top of my list - A Muncie equiped with the 3:32 final drive from the high-mileage 84 case would win hands-down over anybody's worshiped 5 speed Getrag anyday

- but then again, thats just my opinion - and lets face it, opinions are like used car salesman, everybody dispises them :la:

Ahh, I see, I thought so about the VIN, just making sure so I don't look dumb when I go to check it out.

I'm not picky about the trans, as I will most likely break one eventually anyway, as long as it is standard, and I like having 5 gears to work with so... /shrug

Converting a notch to a fastback rear would be difficult from what I know, and would look slightly awkward/out of place unless done INCREDIBLY professionally due to the pillar placement??

So odds are it is indeed a fastback, but are all fastbacks also GTs? I was told this and didn't believe it, I thought fastbacks were offered in lower trim levels, not just the top dog. I'm not just worried about looks, I'd love to have the improvements of the GT.

derangedsheep · Post by **derangedsheep** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 2:39 pm

nfswift wrote: Converting a notch to a fastback rear would be difficult from what I know, and would look slightly awkward/out of place unless done INCREDIBLY professionally due to the pillar placement??

So odds are it is indeed a fastback, but are all fastbacks also GTs? I was told this and didn't believe it, I thought fastbacks were offered in lower trim levels, not just the top dog. I'm not just worried about looks, I'd love to have the improvements of the GT.

If you pull the body panels off, every Fiero's frame is exactly the same (except I think some 84s, but that't not important). Converting a notchback to a fastback can be done in just a couple of hours, it's really very simple. Don't assume it's a factory fastback just because it has the fastback clip on it.

nfswift · Post by **nfswift** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 2:41 pm

Ahh... I thought there were actual frame differences!

Hopefully this is a GT! Hopefully he'll throw the keys at me! :love4:

stimpy · Post by **stimpy** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 2:57 pm

Boscolingus wrote:Regardless if it was or wasn't a GT to begin with, it is now and thats all that really matters.

Not so. If you replace "GT" with "fastback" then you have an accurate statement, but just as the engine can be swapped, the body panels can be swapped. Now, it sounds like like parts are swapped around, so it's not going to be crossing the block at Barret Jackson or winning any Concours in the future. If you're worried about getting GT suspension parts, it sounds like a crapshoot to me. If tthe price is right and you're going to upgrade your suspension in the future anyhow, then it might be worth the gamble. To me it sounds like a conglomeration of junk parts, and unless it was from a builder with a good rep like Ed Parks, I'd walk.

edit-
Reading your post over again, I would wager a dollar and a donut that it's a duke powered, Izusu trannied 85 coupe with a fastback clip. Walk.

Boscolingus · Post by **Boscolingus** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 3:04 pm

stimpy wrote:
Boscolingus wrote:Regardless if it was or wasn't a GT to begin with, it is now and thats all that really matters.

edit-
Reading your post over again, I would wager a dollar and a donut that it's a duke powered, Izusu trannied 85 coupe with a fastback clip. Walk.

Stimp, I'm thinking the exact same thing, and I'm ALWAYS skeptical of anybody's else's engine swaps as I have seen some real hay-bagged cars in my time. If the car is less than a grand I would condier it, if it is 500 bucks, I would take it.

I'mthinking you don't plan on doing any conversions or swaping so what your getting is a car that has slightly more power than a 4 cylinder, but still handles like a 4 cylinder.

nfswift · Post by **nfswift** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 3:35 pm

I was told it is an 86.

And if for some miraculous reason it has the good parts and is a GT, then I will consider it.

He wants 2500... fastback glass broken and all.

I will attempt to undercut by half that, if not less.

Will post results around 7PM PST =P

Boscolingus · Post by **Boscolingus** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 4:05 pm

offer him 1,000 and drive-off, once you get the VIN I can run a Vincent and Oasis and check vehicle history - Carfax is only good if the accident was actually reported :la:

nfswift · Post by **nfswift** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 4:08 pm

Boscolingus wrote:offer him 1,000 and drive-off, once you get the VIN I can run a Vincent and Oasis and check vehicle history - Carfax is only good if the accident was actually reported :la:

I think that's the plan, as long as the car looks solid etc.

And holy crap, I'd appreciate that so much Bosco, I was gonna carfax it if it looked worth it, you have special access to better services??

Boscolingus · Post by **Boscolingus** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 4:10 pm

One of the perks of being a used-car salesman :la: hehehe

nfswift · Post by **nfswift** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 4:18 pm

Boscolingus wrote:One of the perks of being a used-car salesman :la: hehehe

Wow, nice.

I'll give you the numbers once I see the car, much thanks!

stimpy · Post by **stimpy** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 4:40 pm

Best strategy.

Pull up, get out of the car and ask to see the one he has for sale. As SOON as you see it (or he acknowledges that the POS in front of his house is the one he is talking about), laugh and say "You're joking, right?" and turn back toward your car. Once you get to your car, perpetrate like you're talking on your celphone. If he wants to deal, he'll come over to you. If he doesn't want to deal, fuck him. $2500 is a lot of money for a coupe. I can't imagine Canadian Fieros are that rare.

Again, I doubt it's a Quad4. I still think it's a Duke on an Isuzu. I thought you said 85.

nfswift · Post by **nfswift** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 4:42 pm

stimpy wrote:Best strategy.

Pull up, get out of the car and ask to see the one he has for sale. As SOON as you see it (or he acknowledges that the POS in front of his house is the one he is talking about), laugh and say "You're joking, right?" and turn back toward your car. Once you get to your car, perpetrate like you're talking on your celphone. If he wants to deal, he'll come over to you.

Again, I doubt it's a Quad4. I still think it's a Duke on an Isuzu. I thought you said 85.

I already blew that kinda cover, asked too many questions over the phone, said too much.

And negative, it's 86.

Edit: he seemed open for test driving too, donno how much I'll be able to undercut him on price..

Looking like it does though, I bet nobody short of an enthusiast specifically looking for a fastback project would ever talk to him about it.

product1620 · Post by **product1620** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 4:44 pm

If it does indeed have a quad 4, then it has a fwd getrag.

stimpy · Post by **stimpy** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 4:50 pm

nfswift wrote:
stimpy wrote:Best strategy.

Pull up, get out of the car and ask to see the one he has for sale. As SOON as you see it (or he acknowledges that the POS in front of his house is the one he is talking about), laugh and say "You're joking, right?" and turn back toward your car. Once you get to your car, perpetrate like you're talking on your celphone. If he wants to deal, he'll come over to you.

Again, I doubt it's a Quad4. I still think it's a Duke on an Isuzu. I thought you said 85.
I already blew that kinda cover, asked too many questions over the phone, said too much.

And negative, it's 86.

Coupe always had Isuzus, so the year doesn't really make a difference. If it's an 86 with a Getrag, that pretty unlikely. GT's didn't go to Getrags until late in the model year, and with the low quantity of GT's shipped to Canada.... It's worth running a Carfax.

stimpy · Post by **stimpy** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 4:55 pm

product1620 wrote:If it does indeed have a quad 4, then it could have a fwd getrag.

Fixed, and true.

nfswift · Post by **nfswift** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 4:56 pm

stimpy wrote: Coupe always had Isuzus, so the year doesn't really make a difference. If it's an 86 with a Getrag, that pretty unlikely. GT's didn't go to Getrags until late in the model year, and with the low quantity of GT's shipped to Canada.... It's worth running a Carfax.

Oh, I agree.

I don't care which it has IN it, just that is has the capacity for better stuff later. If I could find a cheap 5 speed GT around here, it would be a modern day miracle.

These cars ar MYTHICALLY rare around here =P

Why do you think I want one so bad!?