The Mule rides again (sort of) - pics.

[ericjon262]

if it's far enough to engage the pinch bolt, that's far enough for me. but there's also the possibility of getting a shaft from another vehicle, GM used these columns all over the place...

I'll look into that when I have a little more time... Just got laid off, so I'm trying to figure out what's up.

I hope things get turned back around for you, good luck.

[The Dark Side of Will]

Over the weekend I got the FINAL wires hooked up for the Shelby harness adapter.

The Shelby A/C request signal from the HVAC panel is analogous to the Fiero A/C on signal. The Shelby computer reads ground via the pressure cycling switch and operates the compressor 100% via software.
I grounded the Shelby pressure cycling switch wire. This *should* cause the Shelby PCM to keep the compressor on at all times except over 86% throttle or above ~4000 RPM. Meanwhile, the Fiero A/C system will continue to work as it currently does.

My alternative was:
In the Fiero, the pressure cycling switch has switched +12V from the HVAC panel on one side and the A/C comp relay primary on the other side. To make the Shelby setup work, I'd have had to take the +12V side of the PCS and ground it, then redirect the relay primary high side wire to the PCM instead. I'd then have to pull relay primary power from the PCM power supply.
Making those mods to the car didn't give me the reversibility I was looking for, which is the whole reason I'm building the harness adapter instead of modifying the harness right away.

I spliced the OBDII port into the harness adapter. I squeezed the two ground wires from it, the pressure cycling switch wire and the MAF ground wire--all 20 ga--into one 16-18 splice with one 18 ga wire on the other side, so I can ground them all with one lug.
I added the A/C request wire from the C203 to the Caddy PCM connector. The Caddy system did NOT originally have an A/C Request line because the PCM received A/C comp instructions from the HVAC panel via the data bus. The HVAC panel monitored the functions of the A/C system.
I also added a clutch switch wire from the C203 (would be the TCC brake switch in an auto trans car) to the Caddy PCM cruise brake switch pin.

I ALSO finally ran the clutch switch wire from the clutch switch to the chassis side of the C203. It wasn't as much of a PITA to fish it through the console as I thought it would be, but it works now.

I'm flying out for two weeks with the Navy on Saturday, so I won't be able to work on this again until 3/23 at the EARLIEST, as I may have an additional 2 weeks taking me through 4/6 or so. My girlfriend is having knee surgery on 4/8, so I'll won't be able to to work on the car much while she's recovering from that.

What remains to do for the Shelby computer is to swap the OBDI throttle to the OBDII throttle--which appears to be a PITA because the throttle has to be disassembled and reassembled on the manifold vice just bolting on--then install the harness adapter and computer.

In addition to getting laid off on Monday, I also hit some expressway debris which flattened my rear tire. I already needed front tires, so I just had to order 4. Feh.

[The Dark Side of Will]

Bad alignment sent my front tires to an early grave. I hit some road debris Monday that did the same to one of my rears... So now I get to buy an entire set of tires. And I have to limit myself to the cheapos, too, because of the layoff.

The shop that mounted and balanced attempted to align and found that the UHMW Polyethylene bushings I'd made years and years ago were worn. I guess it's time for spherical bearings now. I had originally gone with UHMW PE on the assumption that spherical bearings would be "too harsh" for a street car. Having driven the UHMW bushings, I think that's bunk. To me, they are barely worse than rubber.

So I figure I'll just snag a bunch of these: http://secure.chassisshop.com/partlist/6455/



And weld them into the control arms. The only ticklish part will be tacking them in place to make sure that they're positioned correctly so that they bolt in without any axial preload on the spherical bearings.
Then I'll have serviceable spherical bearings for the rear control arms and front lowers... probably easiest bushing changes possible in a Fiero.

[The Dark Side of Will]

Does anyone have the outer shell diameter dimensions of the rear and front lower control arm bushings?

Having that info will help me pick out the right weld cup without having to buy trial bushings myself.

Of course those bushings are fairly cheap, so I may just snag them anyway.

Edit: Blast from the past UHMW bushing info: http://realfierotech.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?p=27626 (unfortunately does not include external dimensions of the steel shells.

[The Dark Side of Will]

How do the '84-'87 and '88 front lower control arm bushings compare?
I know that one urethane kit covers both applications.

RockAuto does not show any front lower bushings for the '88, so I can't compare listings via that site.
I see that the Fiero Store shows the same bushings between '84-'87 front lowers and '88 front lowers.
I'm @$$uming that RockAuto doesn't list them for all years because the '88's may have had a different durometer spec and therefore a different part number in GM's system.

If the shell dimensions are close enough that the same weld sleeve would work for both applications, then I'll just make an additional set to use on my Formula.

I'll also evaluate to see if one design can satisfy the needs of both rears and front lowers for the '84-'87 cars. It would be sweet if one design could replace all three bushing applications.

I ordered a set of '84-'87 rear and front lower bushings from Rock Auto, so I'll have the raw data soon enough.

[The Dark Side of Will]

Both bushings and my new set of calipers are in.

The front center sleeve is ~0.200 longer than the rear center sleeve.
The larger rear press diameter is ~0.065 bigger than the larger front press diameter.
The smaller rear press diameter is ~0.080 bigger than the smaller front press diameter.

Unfortunately, I don't think I can use the same part for both applications. However, I can use the same spherical bearing spacers and just use .100 thick shims on each side at the front end locations.

I could possibly wrap .030 shim stock around a front end part and use it in the rear... maybe the welder would be willing to work with that.

Not a big to make two different designs... just a bit of a PITA. Thanks GM.

[The Dark Side of Will]

Spent a bit more time with the bushings and scratching out some sketches. I have a configuration of weld cup that I think will work in place of both bushing shells.
However to finalize the OD profile, properly locate the spherical bearing axially within the cup and spec the three different end spacer lengths I'll need in order bolt in to the stock chassis pick up locations, I'll need to get my hands on some control arms.

I'm away for Navy duty this month, but will be back the weekend of the 6th.

[The Dark Side of Will]

Shelby computer is in and running.

With the Caddy computer "exploded" to life when started... It would flash to 2000 RPM and settle back to idle. Quite dramatic, but unnecessary. With the Shelby computer, it starts at idle like a normal car.
The engine is also much quicker to return to idle when I release the throttle. For the first time EVER, it DOES NOT STALL when I sink the clutch on overrun.
The idle is stable, although it "hiccups" when it transitions from cold idle to closed-loop idle.
There is no DFCO .

The tune is WAY off... for this engine. It falls on its face at WOT above 2500ish RPM, so I'm thinking it's pulling timing due to knock. I'll have to fill up on Sunoco and see if that gets any better.

Fortunately, this computer is tunable via HPTuners, so I can have any shop with HPTuners that has experience with with LS1's (don't they all?) hammer out the base tune.

The OBDII throttle cam is very different and much more progressive than the OBDI throttle cam. The engine's much more controllable at parking lot throttle now than it was; as a side effect, my right foot calibration had to enter learning mode, and was a bit clumsy on the test drive last night.
My dad had a similar experience with the TPI 400 in his Jaguar. The TPI throttle cam wasn't progressive and the car has 3.31 gears, so it was easy to unintentionally to bark the tires when leaving a stoplight. The more progressive LT1 throttle cam mitigated that tendency.

Had to file out an opening for the Fiero throttle cable in the Caddy throttle cable bracket. That was a PITA, but done now.

The hose "nipple" on the MAF housing is slightly larger than the hose connection on the OBDI throttle, so it was pretty tough to stretch my previous intake hose onto that fitting. Now that this throttle with its integral MAF housing is installed, I can work on my 3.5" intake tube, for which I've had aluminum donut halves on the shelf for ever.
I will also need to get a couple of different PCV tubes to accommodate the new PCV connection locations.

3.94 gearset, diff side/spider gears, IMS and some extra CV joint cups are back from Liberty's... they're blingin'. Pics of all too follow.

[ericjon262]

so you're running 1 coil per cylinder now? I wonder how a LS1 tune would compare to a N* tune...

[The Dark Side of Will]

No, still using the coil pack.
The computer is the same hardware as the '98 LS1 F-body cars, but the Shelby program is unique in that it is written to operate the Northstar ignition.

Shows up on OBDII applications listings as a "1998 Oldsmobile Shelby"

[Sinister Fiero]

I'm glad to hear it starts, runs, and idles. Concerning the tune, the one unknown for me was exactly what MAF sensor the Shelby used. I didn't have that information and I'm betting the MAF calibration is off in your tune for the MAF sensor you are using on your engine.

The open to closed loop transition hiccup is something I've experienced on a few 1998 3800 tunes and I'm not sure what is causing it. Using a 99 3800 OS on the same PCM and engine, the problem went away. Unfortunately, we only have one OS for the Shelby tune so some digging might be required to 1) first determine what is going on causing the hiccup and then 2) what needs to be done to correct the problem - if it can even be corrected.

I would really like to see some data from this 1st tune I made you based on the Shelby code. The absolute cheapest way to go would be the Android Torque Pro app and ELM OBD interface that I talked about in the thread I started on Old Europe. HOWEVER, I'm not sure this app is going to give use enhanced data PIDs for this Shelby OS. I don't have anything with the Shelby tune on it here at my shop to try it out on. At the very least, you are going to need the following data PIDs available MINIMUM to log no matter what you use to get data:

-MAF flow (gm/sec or Hz)
-MAP (kpa)
-ECT (coolant temp)
-RPM
-KR (knock retard)
-B1S1 & B2S1 O2 sensor voltage
-B1 Short & Long Term Fuel Trims
-B2 Short & Long Term Fuel Trims

Anything else is a bonus.

HP Tuners VCM Scanner should do the job. Not sure about anything else (including Torque Pro).

-ryan

[ericjon262]

any benefit to running the N*coilpack instead of CPC? the programming would be less oddball then wouldn't it, as you could tune it strait up as an "LS1"

[The Dark Side of Will]

I don't have space on my phone for Torque, but I've been needing to upgrade to a phone that supports tethering anyway...
Torque is available for Windoze PC, right? I should be able to log with my netbook.

At 11.5 static comp and the 266 intake cam, I'm sure dynamic compression is pretty high. I should dig up my old engine dimensions spreadsheet and see what it actually is. I don't think the program I was running in the Caddy computer had closed loop knock control enabled. It wouldn't surprise me if I'm getting a little bit of knock with the Shelby calibration, especially considering that the slightly different cam grind for that application changes the shape of the VE curve, and thus the timing curve to some extent, significantly.

For example, I don't think it pulls as hard below 2000 RPM as it did with the Caddy computer. There were several times on the trip back to NoVA from my dad's house that it felt like it was laboring on a hill that I don't think would have been a problem with the Caddy comp.

I'm about to order the blue tooth OBDII interface mentioned previously in this thread.

We may have discussed before, but did you see any DFCO options in the calibration?

Can't wait to try out the 7,000 RPM limiter.

[The Dark Side of Will]

any benefit to running the N*coilpack instead of CPC? the programming would be less oddball then wouldn't it, as you could tune it strait up as an "LS1"

Benefit: It works fine and it's already on the engine

The '93-'99 Northstar 32x crank wheel is only compatible with the Northstar coil pack. Changing the trigger wheel out for the 24x LS1 trigger wheel in order to run it with an LS1 program would not be feasible.

[ericjon262]

that makes sense, I forgot the N* had an oddball crank wheel.

[The Dark Side of Will]

Yeah, it annoys the F@#$ out of me sometimes, but that's what GM did.

BMW used COP ignitions on their base model 6 cylinder engines starting in '91 or so... Why couldn't GM do that on their top shelf V8?

[Sinister Fiero]

Below are all the DFCO related parameters that I can tune in this OS (and the stock settings for them)....

DFCO Enable Delay Time 0.8 Sec.
DFCO Enable Delay Time (CAT Overtemp) 0.8 Sec.
DFCO Enable Coolant Temp. - Clutch Based 139.9 Deg. C (maybe this is the problem?)
DFCO Disable MAP - Clutch Based 50 RPM
DFCO Disable %TPS - Clutch Based 10 %TPS
DFCO Disable MPH - Clutch Based 30 MPH
DFCO Enable Coolant Temp. 80 Deg. C
DFCO Disable Negative Delta RPM -75 RPM
DFCO Re-enable Delay - Clutch Based 1 Sec.
DFCO Re-entry Delay 1 Sec.
DFCO Enable Vehicle Speed Hysteresis 2 MPH
DFCO Enable RPM Hysteresis 2.9 RPM
DFCO Enable Max MAP Hysteresis 1 Kpa
DFCO Disable TPS Hysteresis 1 %TPS

DFCO Enable Vehicle Speed Vs. Baro
Kpa MPH
65 10.0
75 10.0
85 10.0
95 10.0
105 10.0


DFCO Enable RPM Vs. Gear
Gear RPM
1st 2400.0
2nd 2400.0
3rd 2400.0
4th 2400.0
5th 2400.0
6th 2400.0
7th 2400.0
8th 2400.0
P/N 2400.0
Rev 2400.0


DFCO Disable RPM Vs. Gear
Gear RPM
1st 1400.0
2nd 1400.0
3rd 1400.0
4th 1400.0
5th 1400.0
6th 1400.0
7th 1400.0
8th 1400.0
P/N 1600.0
Rev 1400.0


DFCO Enable Max MAP Vs. Baro
Kpa Kpa
60 28.01
70 28.01
80 28.01
90 28.01
100 28.01


DFCO Disable MAP Vs. Baro
Kpa Kpa
60 40.00
70 40.00
80 40.00
90 40.00
100 40.00


DFCO Disable TPS Vs. RPM
RPM %TPS
0 0.00
400 0.00
800 0.00
1200 1.00
1600 1.19
2000 1.70
2400 3.11
2800 5.00
3200 6.99
3600 9.00
4000 10.00
4400 10.00
4800 10.00
5200 10.00
5600 10.00
6000 10.00
6400 10.00
6800 10.00
7200 10.00
7600 10.00
8000 10.00

[ericjon262]

Yeah, it annoys the F@#$ out of me sometimes, but that's what GM did.

BMW used COP ignitions on their base model 6 cylinder engines starting in '91 or so... Why couldn't GM do that on their top shelf V8?

what's weird to me, is that GM will use the same part on 50 different engines, and then on 500 different cars... why not have one style of ignition for 8 cylinder engines, one for 6 cylinder, ect... same with PCM programming, why do you need two entirely different programs when one would operate both no problem...

no wonder they went bankrupt...

[The Dark Side of Will]

DFCO Enable Coolant Temp. - Clutch Based 139.9 Deg. C (maybe this is the problem?)

Certainly looks like that would turn off DFCO... Same way EGR is turned off in OBDI vehicles... set the coolant temp enable threshold to 255 degrees (and speed limiters for that matter).

[ericjon262]

The cruise clutch switch and the cruise brake switch have the same diameter mounting. The clutch switch electrical pole and the brake switch TCC pole appear to be identical. The brake switch cruise servo pole would do *EXACTLY* what I need the clutch switch to do for the Shelby computer.
It *should* be as simple as swapping an extra brake switch into the clutch switch location.
Except that I can't find a part number for the brake switch.

Anyone know?

I know you already found one, but I needed one myself and didn't want to pay $50 for it.

1994 camaro Z28 brake light switch

P/n on the back is 10424858

The rear set of four terminals are the ones you need. the front pair, and rear pair both perform as prescribed.