The Mule rides again (sort of) - pics.

Real tech discussion on design, fabrication, testing, development of custom or adapted parts for Pontiac Fieros. Not questions about the power a CAI will give.

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The Dark Side of Will
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Re: The Mule rides again (sort of) - pics.

Post by The Dark Side of Will »

No idea... that's why I want to instrument :wink:
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Aaron
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Re: The Mule rides again (sort of) - pics.

Post by Aaron »

Why the 4.0 cylinder heads?
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Re: The Mule rides again (sort of) - pics.

Post by The Dark Side of Will »

They start off with smaller chambers than the 4.6 heads. They have smaller valves too, so the chambers get enlarged to some extent when the larger valves are installed and de-shrouded, but I think they still end up a couple cc's smaller than the 4.6 chambers. As the heads are ~$50 each from junkyards, snagging a set is not a big deal.
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Re: The Mule rides again (sort of) - pics.

Post by The Dark Side of Will »

For the Spherical bearing sleeves, I was looking at Seal Master BTS-12LS. That one would have worked great, except that it's too big. If they had a BTS-10LS, that would be the ideal part.

http://www.motionindustries.com/motion3 ... 3ERod+Ends
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Re: The Mule rides again (sort of) - pics.

Post by The Dark Side of Will »

Need to measure the overall bolt pattern for mounting early and '88 steering racks.

Notice the driver's side mount on this rack:

Image

If the stars line up, it might bolt right up to the Fiero left rack mount.
A pillow block style clamp could then secure the right end of the rack to the right mount on the crossmember.
Worst case scenario might be a plate that bolts to the Fiero crossmember and then has appropriate mounts for the Pinto rack.

I'll have to do a little more research, but I *think* that a "Pinto Style" rack can be had with almost any length or ratio.

Two different pillow blocks:
http://www.davidlemmond.com/rackmount.html
http://www.flamingriver.com/index.php/p ... 12/FR1617P

Edit: more Pinto rack info:
http://www.cachassisworks.com/c-184-rac ... pinto.aspx
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Series8217
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Re: The Mule rides again (sort of) - pics.

Post by Series8217 »

The angle of the pinion vs the rack is very steep on the Pinto. Fieros need a very shallow angle. You would need to modify the front firewall and/or build a wonky shaft to hook it up, assuming it's even possible to work with it being that steep.
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Re: The Mule rides again (sort of) - pics.

Post by The Dark Side of Will »

Ooo... Finally found decent spherical bearing seals:

http://mdmetric.com/rodend/fluro/eG-2RS.htm
Edit: Additional Source: http://rodend-bearings.hirschmannusa.co ... d-rod-ends

Image

http://mdmetric.com/rodend/fluro/G----16-2RSDruck.htm

Image



Looks like a really high end sealing product, waaaaayyyy more advanced than the SealsIt washers, that work on standard spherical bearings.


Info on sealed bearings: http://nhbb.com/reference/rod-ends-bear ... rings.aspx
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Re: The Mule rides again (sort of) - pics.

Post by Series8217 »

Cool find. Now where do we get some metric threaded adjuster tubes??
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Re: The Mule rides again (sort of) - pics.

Post by The Dark Side of Will »

The seals are sized in metric, but obviously the 16mm ones should work just fine on 5/8" rod ends.
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Re: The Mule rides again (sort of) - pics.

Post by Series8217 »

The Dark Side of Will wrote:The seals are sized in metric, but obviously the 16mm ones should work just fine on 5/8" rod ends.
I don't think the integrated 16mm reducer bushing is going to fit in a 5/8" (15.875 mm) hole.
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Re: The Mule rides again (sort of) - pics.

Post by The Dark Side of Will »

Maybe not... I'd gotten so used to interchanging 16mm and 5/8 in real life I didn't think about the more precise applications.

I'm looking at applications for spherical bearings/"uniballs", though, not rod ends, so for now I'm not as concerned about the metric adjustment tubes. :wink:
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Re: The Mule rides again (sort of) - pics.

Post by fieroguru »

Series8217 wrote:Cool find. Now where do we get some metric threaded adjuster tubes??
Woodward Steering has metric swaged tubes in their catalog, but all of them are listed as unavailable due to material shortage. Might call them to see if that is still the case.
http://www.woodwardsteering.com/images/ ... 0tubes.pdf
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Re: The Mule rides again (sort of) - pics.

Post by The Dark Side of Will »

I'm working on a Supply Chain Risk Management study for NASA... That's a classic example of getting bushwhacked by supply chain risk.

I think the hit on future maintainability would be too big to go for metric rod ends.
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Re: The Mule rides again (sort of) - pics.

Post by The Dark Side of Will »

Series8217 wrote:The angle of the pinion vs the rack is very steep on the Pinto. Fieros need a very shallow angle. You would need to modify the front firewall and/or build a wonky shaft to hook it up, assuming it's even possible to work with it being that steep.
Or Mjata:

Image
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Re: The Mule rides again (sort of) - pics.

Post by The Dark Side of Will »

Adjustable control arms:

1" tube x .065 wall (16 ga) 180 degree bend on a 3" radius with 3" legs.
http://www.mandrel-bends.com/catalog/1- ... d-496.html
$10.50 each QTY: 2 TOT: $21.00

Threaded tube adapters with 5/8-18 threads for 1" tubing with .065 wall:
http://secure.chassisshop.com/partdetail/C73-898-2/
$15.90 each QTY: 4 TOT: $63.60

Aurora CM10 rod ends (Chromoly, 5/8-18 shank, 5/8 hole with .750 ball width):
Specs: http://cad.aurorabearing.com/item/al-in ... bl-3/am-10
http://secure.chassisshop.com/partdetail/CM10/ (This is in line with prices I saw elsewhere for Aurora units)
$14.72 each QTY: 4 TOT: 58.88

SealsIt Rod end seals for 5/8" rod ends:
http://www.sealsit.com/rodend.asp
$14.40 per pack QTY: 2 packs TOT $28.80
These are sold in packs of 6, so I get to seal 6 rod ends for a little more than the Chassis Shop wants to let me seal 4.

However, SealsIt wants $11 shipping, so my seal order went to Chassis Shop.

Total parts: $171.78

All the parts are ordered. I already had the bends from last order... now the rod ends, tube adapters and seals are on the way.


In other news: SealsIt shock bearing seals:
http://www.sealsit.com/shockbearing.asp

Image

This looks similar to Steven's need thrust bearings under his coil over springs, but without the exposed grease:
http://www.sealsit.com/coil_sc.asp

Image
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Re: The Mule rides again (sort of) - pics.

Post by The Dark Side of Will »

Aaron wrote:Or your engine is moving around a lot. I assume, knowing you, that it's pretty well mounted. Have you inspected all parts of the cradle? You've already got cracks in one part, I'm wondering if it might be worse than that.
Missed this...

It's not uncommon for cradles in 300+ HP Fieros in which the power is regularly used to crack at that location.

Last summer I repaired some cracks due to inadequate gusseting in the custom engine mount bracket at the right rear corner mount.

I haven't checked the forward trans mount.

The forward engine mount bracket is beefy and the mount bolts to a piece of 2x3 rectangular tubing, so I'm pretty sure it's doing fine.

I don't have the engine solidly mounted, so it's going to move somewhat anyway. I have 4000 ftlbs at the axle in 1st, so it's going to move a little bit.
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Re: The Mule rides again (sort of) - pics.

Post by The Dark Side of Will »

http://www.autopartswarehouse.com/sku/L ... 20774.html

Lemfoerder W0133-1620774

Image

Looks good, but may be too big... I'll have to see if I can get one to try out.
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Re: The Mule rides again (sort of) - pics.

Post by CincinnatiFiero »

Looks like a Mercedes control arm bushing. Those are pressed into the bottom of the rear spindles where the lower control arm attaches. I've got a new one in the box at my warehouse, I can try to get some measurements off it.
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Re: The Mule rides again (sort of) - pics.

Post by The Dark Side of Will »

The website said it's for an E65/66/67 760i... Might have a Mercedes cross-reference also; or Merc could have their own part. In either case I am interested in dimensions.

The biggest deals are the diameter of the housing and the diameter of the shoulder. I can't accommodate anything much bigger than 1 3/16 (1.187"). I have not had the end spacers made, so I can accommodate any length.
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Re: The Mule rides again (sort of) - pics.

Post by CincinnatiFiero »

I wouldnt be surprised if that style joint comes in a ton of sizes. The W124 one does not have the lip on one side like that one does.
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